Questions every AMERICAN should ask regarding 9-11..

[hooch]

Remember last year ago that golfers (Payne Stewart) private jet crashed because everybody inside passed out from depressurization. Within MINUTES, on an immediate alert from the FAA, U.S. Air Force and
Air Guard jets were scrambled to intercept Stewart's jet and see what
the heck was up (not that it helped much in that case...): "Several Air
Force and Air National Guard fighter jets, plus an AWACS radar control
plane, helped the Federal Aviation Administration track the runaway
Learjet and estimate when it would run out of fuel." --CNN, 10.26.99

Interceptors were in direct proximity to Stewart's seriously messed-up
aircraft within about TEN MINUTES of him having taken off. NOBODY had to
go pull Clinton away from Vice-president Monica Lewinsky and get him to
AUTHORIZE the INTERCEPT of Payne Stewart's jet that day.

Moreover, according to the same CNN article: "...officers on the Joint
Chiefs were monitoring the Learjet on radar screens inside the
Pentagon's National Military Command Center. -- CNN, 10.26.99

Air Traffic Controllers request military intercepts of private and
commercial planes REGULARLY. Sometimes it's because communications have
broken off; sometimes it's to inform a pilot that his plane has gone off
course; other times it's to observe the situation directly - for
instance, to see who's actually flying the plane and things like that.
None of this requires presidential approval.

Fast forward to 9/11. The BUSH Admin has INTEL that US airliners will be hijacked by Al-Quaida (AS they now ADMIT). Then one morning FAA loses contact with FOUR airliners which DRAMATICALLY alter there course, turn off their transponders and head towards NYC and DC. It is another 45-60 minutes before they start slamming into bulidings. In that time frame not ONE US AIR FORCE jet made an intercept. What the fuck???? They can intercept a golfers plane but not one hijacked airliner???

STOP defending BUSH and START asking the GOV'T HOW THIS COULD HAPPEN!!!!!!!! Better yet ask WHY they LET it happen!!!!!

 

[the nature boy]

interesting.

 

[manny78]

thing is: if they had intercept the airliners and shot them down, what would the US population think about that ? Thats a pretty hot topic....

 

[hooch]

Yeah but not ONE military jet went to least investigate.....?????????????????????????????

 

[danielson]

saw a report on this today

 

[buddy28]

oh yea.

Its just starting to unravell now.

Hooch makes a great fucking point every single american should seriously ask themselves.

No military aircraft were available to make rountine interceptions of not one, not two, but 4 hijacked civilian airliners the morning of sept 11th, over the course of 1 whole HOUR, when just weeks prior the President was informed Al Queda may be possibly planning to hijack US civilian airliners.

We begin to venture into real thorny ground when we ask these types of questions.

 

[Code]

The hijackers in 9/11 removed the transponders, they couldn't locate the planes if they wanted to.

Just a little plot hole to consider.

 

[danielson]

The hijackers in 9/11 removed the transponders, they couldn't locate the planes if they wanted to.

Just a little plot hole to consider.

i may not be an expert on this (so likely wrong ) but doesnt a transponder just allow the ground team to identify a plane as opposed to knowing that a big flying object has the same vector as boeing had previously.

surely an unidentified radar contact merits a response?

 

[Prometheus]

perhaps those questions you're asking are linked to this story somehow:

--------
Big Brother Is Watching, Listening
SAN FRANCISCO, May 15 2002

(CBS) It is America's new reality: security and surveillance. From intense scrutiny at airports to expanded government authority to track Internet use, federal agents now watch American citizens more closely than ever, reports CBS News Correspondent John Blackstone.

Such scrutiny seemed over the line to retired phone company worker Barry Reingold, after the FBI got interested in remarks Reingold made at his health club. After loudly criticizing the war in Afghanistan, Reingold had some unexpected visitors a few days later.

"I said, you know, 'Who's there?' And they said, 'It's the FBI,'" said Reingold, 60.

Reingold says the two agents wanted to know more about his locker room outburst.

"Someone's reported to us that you've been talking about what happened on 9/11 and terrorism and oil and Afghanistan," Reingold said the agents told him.

The FBI insists agents do not interview people because of their political views. But since 9/11, the agency says it needs to cast a wider net than ever in its search for information.

That's helped create fears the FBI could slip back to the days of J. Edgar Hoover, when the agency went outside the law to watch Americans whose politics Hoover disagreed with.

The current FBI director Robert Mueller says investigations today are lawful — and thorough.

"If we get a threat," Mueller said, "We will do everything we can to interview anybody who may have some information about that threat."

When a locker room bull session can bring questions from the FBI, it's clear agents are casting a wide net indeed.
-----------------


rest of article:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/05/15/eveningnews/main509140.shtml

 

[buddy28]

The hijackers in 9/11 removed the transponders, they couldn't locate the planes if they wanted to.

Just a little plot hole to consider.

nope. NORAD and NMCC (National Military Command Council) regularly track all unidentified aircraft in domestic US airspace using ground based radar stations with national radar coverage.

As soon as regional Air Traffic Controllers request military aircraft intercept of commercial airliners exhibiting suspicious behavor, FAA regional hijack coordinators are notified, who then notify delegated hijack coordinators at NMCC.

NMCC was apparently notified of the intial sept 11th hijackings around 8:40 am. That means they had direct radar contact with various hijacked aircraft for an hour the morning of sept 11th.

 

[Code]

Transponders serve a dual purpose, identifying the aircraft and signaling air traffic controllers the location of the aircraft.

Air traffic controllers use radar as well, but when a plane is not on an incoming route air traffic controllers use transponding informationrather than radar. Mostly because radar relies on line of site, which is hard to acquire in or around cities.


But yes, something as large as a commercial airliner should be noted and tracked. But it's possible the hijackers didn't remove the transponders until minutes before the crash.


Some people just want a conspiracy, it's an earmark of the new era of information. But it's sad that anyone would think that any American (president or homeless) would allow 9/11 to happen. But I can see it's apeal to the conspiracists. And given the fact the conspiracist movement hasn't any new interesting fuel since JFK, it's underastandable that they would cling to this.

 

[Code]

I was unaware that NMCC had prior knowledge of the crash. Interesting, but still doesn't hold much water on a grand scale.

From the 10K foot view, this would suggest that someone would have had to either called back any interception or told them to stand down. Something like that would be leaked. Has that come out (just in case I missed it).

 

[hooch]

How deep does the rabbit hole go???????

 

[Code]

Something this dirty is a rat hole

 

[Prometheus]

The hijackers in 9/11 removed the transponders, they couldn't locate the planes if they wanted to.

Just a little plot hole to consider.

that's what radar is for - if not that of the commercial system than the defense system's - if the defense system could only track planes with transponders then it would useless in intercepting hostile pilots that don't want to be tracked.

they had the flight path graphics on the cable news stations the day of the attack.

 

[hooch]

I say at the VERY LEAST...somebody is criminally negligent.

..and why does something that seems impossible when it regards the true intentions of people in power (in the USA) always have the "Nutty Conspiracy Theory" attached to it....?????

 

[hooch]

"We must speak the truth about terror. Let us never tolerate
outrageous conspiracy theories concerning the attacks of September the 11th,
malicious lies that attempt to shift the blame away from the terrorists
themselves, away from the guilty."

GW Bush speaking before the UN GeGeneral Assembly 11/10/2001

 

[spongebob]

Fast forward to 9/11. The BUSH Admin has INTEL that US airliners will be hijacked by Al-Quaida (AS they now ADMIT). Then one morning FAA loses contact with FOUR airliners which DRAMATICALLY alter there course, turn off their transponders and head towards NYC and DC. It is another 45-60 minutes before they start slamming into bulidings. In that time frame not ONE US AIR FORCE jet made an intercept. What the fuck???? They can intercept a golfers plane but not one hijacked airliner???

STOP defending BUSH and START asking the GOV'T HOW THIS COULD HAPPEN!!!!!!!! Better yet ask WHY they LET it happen!!!!!

so what exactly is your question? the acting FFA director that morning fucked up, he was using pilot discretion to bring planes down, even the ones that crashed into the WTC and pentagon. there were fighter jets in the air, they just didnt allow them to do anything. they screwed up, the FAA that is. i dont need to ask them anything, i know what happen.

 

[gymnpoppa]

interesting post, hooch.

How is it that NOW we find out that Bush knew beforehand?


Different administration, different LIES, but LIES nevertheless.


How people can..................nevermind.

 

[spongebob]

STOP defending BUSH and START asking the GOV'T HOW THIS COULD HAPPEN!!!!!!!! Better yet ask WHY they LET it happen!!!!!

the house and senate intelligence committees are investigating it.

 

[spongebob]

How is it that NOW we find out that Bush knew beforehand?

gym exactly what do you mean bush knew beforehand?

 

[Prometheus]

How is it that NOW we find out that Bush knew beforehand?

one possibility is that the campaigns are starting soon for the Nov. elections, so the Democrats and their supporters in the media might be throwing more of this type of info and/or hype to hurt the Republicans, especially now that the 9/11 mourning period is passed....

Bush and the Republicans have gotten tons of political mileage out of this, and as long as public support for Bush's handling of "the war on terror" is high, the Dems are in trouble - ergo, undermine that support however possible.

 

[gymnpoppa]

He have correspondence before Sept 11th, right? So, he never indicated as much, to his credit, he did say that they had credible evidence of who it was, but apparently they didn't use that properly.

I mean, there are a number of innocent people who were arrested on bogus charges (taxpayers footed that bill), and detained unconstitutionally.


Now, his administration is facing withering criticism about their
dogged determination to withhold information from EVERYONE.


I don't believe anyone of them when they say that there was nothing that could be used to note that something was happening, or when. Do you?


Do you think, given the spin/lying nature of our government, they will tell the truth?

Whether or not, every piece of information is credible, there were a number of related warnings, and there was not nearly enough action.

Would you say that we received at least 4 warnings directly related to ObL, hijackings, and possible plots? Enough to warrant him putting some organizations on alert, but not a thing more?

Stinks to me. Like a typical government blunder, and spin to absolve themselves of any blame. And none of them have come forward, or no one is/has been put on a hot seat yet.

 

[spongebob]

gym i agree 100% with everything you said. were mistakes made? are mistakes still being made? yes and yes.

hopefully there is enough internal and external forces that will give us some kind of truth in the end.

 

[gymnpoppa]

gym i agree 100% with everything you said. were mistakes made? are mistakes still being made? yes and yes.

hopefully there is enough internal and external forces that will give us some kind of truth in the end.

I'm hoping that some good independent soul, with intentions to truly concern themselves with the people will be strengthened by the recent incompetent history of our government.

I hope that american people open their eyes, and affect this situation the only way they can.....at the ballot box.

If we can reform the way we govern (it will take time, the corruptness runs deep), this country can improve.

We need a independent leader of people to step forward. I don't care if they run the country as a business, but a non-conflicting business.

Yes, profits for big corporations will be down, yes, polluters will have to bankrupt themselves to clean up their act, and yes, airlines will file for bankruptcy, GOOD,

the pillars of the economy should rest on business that people will have no qualms about investing in.......

 

[buddy28]

I was unaware that NMCC had prior knowledge of the crash. Interesting, but still doesn't hold much water on a grand scale.

From the 10K foot view, this would suggest that someone would have had to either called back any interception or told them to stand down. Something like that would be leaked. Has that come out (just in case I missed it).

I agree. IF the NMCC was informed of the first hijacking at 8:40 am (which they were), and ordered intercept aircraft deployment at 9:40am, a significant discrepency exists between NMCC regulations mandating *expeditous* fighter aircraft intercept of 'suspicous' civilian aircraft, and the 50-60 minute interval it took NMCC to scramble intercept aircraft on sept 11th. Given the circumstances surrounding sept 11th, 2 hijacked planes already colliding into the world trade center, the National Military Command Centers apparent indescivness to carry out routine intercept fighter deployment in response to two additional hijacked civilian airliners (one heading toward the nations capital -- completely deviating from its flight plan), is alittle more then troubling.....

Intercept aircraft that were finally deployed by the NMCC, around 9:30am, took off from a CIA air force base located something like 500+ miles away from Washington DC -- the apparent target of the 3rd hijacked aircraft. This left less than 12 minutes for the air force fighters to travel 500+ miles, aquire the civilian airliner, and possible manuever into a position to shoot it down.


A curious response when Andrews Airforce Base, whose official mandate is to provide alert aircraft for protection of Washington DCs airspace, alledgedly had no intercept aircraft available on sept 11th. This is during a period in which the President himself was informed Al Queda may be planning to hijack US civilian airliners and allegedly had taken "the necessary precautions" to thwart possible future attacks. Obviously, one precaution not being ensuring Andrews Air Force base had combat ready aircraft avialable to intercept possible hijacked civilian aircraft, in accordance with the Bases mandate.

Even more curious is top pentagon officials (perhaps even General of the US Air Force?!?) cancelled all travel plans for sept 11th, one day before the attacks were carried out.

1) “NEWSWEEK has learned that while U.S. intelligence received no specific warning, the state of alert had been high during the past two weeks, and a particularly urgent warning may have been received the night before the attacks, causing some top Pentagon brass to cancel a trip. Why that same information was not available to the 266 people who died aboard the four hijacked commercial aircraft may become a hot topic on the Hill.”  
‘We’ve Hit the Targets’, Michael Hirsh, Newsweek, September 13, 2001 issue
http://www.msnbc.com/news/627963.asp

2) "On Sept. 10.... a group of top Pentagon officials suddenly canceled travel plans for the next morning, apparently because of security concerns."
Newsweek 24 September 2001
http://www.msnbc.com/news/629606.asp

Someone seemed to have a pretty good idea what was going on, but negleted to take the appropriate measures.

 

[pushing_fe]

Liberal Democratic Bullshit, I'm surprised they didn't wait six months before the next elections to start this crap.

 

[buddy28]

unbeleviable.

Criticism of Bush is bipartisan. Both democrats and republicans are criticising the Bush administration for the apparent 'mismanagement' of intelligence information which partly preciptitated the sept 11th attacks.

Go to any online media agency. its all over the net.

 

[Frackal]

Liberal Democratic Bullshit, I'm surprised they didn't wait six months before the next elections to start this crap.

Jesus Christ...I am not partisan at all and I agree with this notion that they knew beforehand.

You fucking democrats and republicans are absurd...squabbling like little bitches all day long when in reality both your parties suck ass and don't give a shit about you at all.

 

[decem]

'In retrospect, this looks horrible' - from cnn

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Government officials, politicians and those touched directly by the September 11 attacks spent Thursday assigning blame for what one senator termed their failure to "connect the dots" in the days leading up to the attacks.

The White House admitted Wednesday that intelligence reports last summer suggested the United States could be the target of a terrorist attack, perhaps a hijacking.

But officials said nothing in those reports could have prevented the attacks that struck New York and Washington on September 11, killing more than 3,000 people.

"In retrospect, this looks horrible. At the time, we were looking at something very different," national security adviser Condoleezza Rice told reporters Thursday afternoon.

Meanwhile, Vice President Dick Cheney pledged that the Bush administration would cooperate with any investigation into the events leading up to September 11.

But he and other Republicans lashed out at Democratic calls for congressional investigations, with Bush reportedly telling Republican senators there was "a sniff of politics in the air." (Full story)

Critics like Sen. Bob Graham, chairman of the Senate Intelligence Committee, said intelligence community did not sufficiently monitor suspected terror activity.

"The president of the United States can't be expected to be an intelligence analyst and a case officer," said Graham, D-Florida.

"The people who are responsible for taking action are the same people who wrote the intelligence information that was submitted to the president."

Some family members of those killed in the attacks expressed sorrow, shock and anger that the government had not issued a more concrete warning. But administration officials said Thursday the information was too vague to warrant a wider alert.

"I think it's shameful that they didn't warn the American people," said Stephen Push, whose wife was killed aboard the American Airlines jet that crashed into the Pentagon. (Full story)

Rice said the administration was justified in not publicizing the information at the time.

"There was no time. There was no place. There was no method of attack," she said.

"It simply said, 'These are people who train and seem to talk simply of hijacking.' You would have risked shutting down the American civil aviation system with such general information," she said during a presentation at the White House. (Transcript)

She said Bush's August 6 presidential briefing suggested that al Qaeda operatives might carry out a "hijacking in the traditional sense," most likely to demand the release of convicted terrorists held in U.S. prisons.

Sen. Richard Shelby, the top Republican on the Intelligence Committee, said the White House should have revealed the warning earlier.

"The fact that they've waited this long to get it out is troubling," said Shelby, R-Alabama.

However, he said the top members of the House and Senate intelligence committees -- himself; Graham; Florida GOP Rep. Porter Goss, the House Intelligence Committee chairman; and California Rep. Nancy Pelosi, the House panel's ranking Democrat -- received the same classified information as the president.

Rice also told Senate Democrats in a meeting Thursday that some of them were privy to the same information.

Graham told reporters he and his colleagues were given a less detailed briefing than the one given to the president, and said he was never given information about potential hijackings.

And some members of the intelligence committees complained that they had not been informed at all.

"That information should have been given to us, and it wasn't," said Rep. Saxby Chambliss, R-Georgia, a member of the House Intelligence Committee.

Former CIA Director Stansfield Turner told CNN part of the problem is that U.S. intelligence analysts need a deeper understanding of Islamic fundamentalist movements like al Qaeda.

"We aren't thinking out of the box enough. We're thinking in terms of our Western Judeo-Christian culture," Turner said.

"I think we ought to have a team out there somewhere today of Islamicists, Middle Eastern experts, academic experts and those things that says to us what could come next."

 

[the nature boy]

boy can you imagine the uproar if slick willie was in office and this shit got out????? gee, where's ttlpkg when you need him?

 

[pushing_fe]

The truth is US Intelligence intercepts threats of this kind all the time. 99.9% of the time it turns out to be false information. Just look at all the warnings we have gotten since 9/11. One time the information turned out to be correct. However, the specifics were never known. There is no way that the White House could have justified releasing this information before the 9/11 attacks. Especially considering that this type of terrorism was unprecedented.

I like many Americans can not believe that the planes were not intercepted, but again this is not the Bush Administrations fault.

 

[havoc]

America and the Govt were just as involved in the 9/11 attacks as Osama and his crew was. Dont be fooled.

 

[WODIN]

America and the Govt were just as involved in the 9/11 attacks as Osama and his crew was. Dont be fooled.

I drive through Newcastle country Del. every day and one day in August before 9/11 I saw massive amounts of troop transports and vehicles going by rail to Dover AFB. Not since the Gulf war or the balkins had that kind of hardware been moving to Dover. A lot of people I know where wondering what was up.

Dover AFB is the traffic hub for most Airborne military traffic to Europ and the Middle east.

The fly those big ass c3's out of there that could carry a small town in them. They are fucking huge!!!

 

[havoc]

I drive through Newcastle country Del. every day and one day in August before 9/11 I saw massive amounts of troop transports and vehicles going by rail to Dover AFB. Not since the Gulf war or the balkins had that kind of hardware been moving to Dover. A lot of people I know where wondering what was up.

Dover AFB is the traffic hub for most Airborne military traffic to Europ and the Middle east.

The fly those big ass c3's out of there that could carry a small town in them. They are fucking huge!!!

Right, I hear you, those fucks knew. Babylon for real I say. peace big E

 

[Needhelp]

They let this happen because they needed an excuse to go into Afganistan.. Remember, We love OIL!

 

[pushing_fe]

They let this happen because they needed an excuse to go into Afganistan.. Remember, We love OIL!

Yes it is true, we import vast amounts of oil from Afghanistan.

Furthermore, I'm sure that all other Islamic oil producing countries were thrilled to see us invade one of their own.

Yes, the Bush administration knew about the attacks, but they let it happen just so we could pillage the wealthy, strategically important country of Afghanistan.

 

[spongebob]

the pakistani at my local quicky mart told me that he had been taking flight lessons for 5 years and that he was actually given a visa by the bush admin. to do so. he mentioned several high ranking officials names within the cia and fbi and speciffically told me that he was one of the jet fighter interceptors that day and thats why the planes were not forced down. i too drive around quite often and feel he is telling the truth. i have personally witnessed truckloads of slushies driving to bush's ranch. the govt. will do anything for a slushie.

 

[pushing_fe]

It's true, GW is a Slush Puppie whore!

 

[buddy28]

Yes it is true, we import vast amounts of oil from Afghanistan.

Furthermore, I'm sure that all other Islamic oil producing countries were thrilled to see us invade one of their own.

Yes, the Bush administration knew about the attacks, but they let it happen just so we could pillage the wealthy, strategically important country of Afghanistan.

where have you been?


type in "Caspien Sea Oil Reserves" into google. Report back what you find.

Better yet, heres alittle primer:


http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2001/11/20011128-11.html

The caspien sea oil pipeline(s) has the potential to pump over 1 million Barrels a day, straight to US tankers waiting at terminal ports on the Pakistani Coast (our new found best buddy in the whole wide world!!!).

READ:

Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan pipeline: Unocal

"From the outset, we have made it clear that construction of the pipeline we have proposed across Afghanistan COULD NOT BEGIN UNITIL A RECOGNIZED GOVERNMENT is in place that has the confidence of governments, lenders, and our company.....The 1,040-mile long oil pipeline would extend south through Afghanistan to an export terminal that would be constructed on the Pakistan coast. This 42-inch diameter pipeline will have a shipping capacity of one million barrels of oil per day.... The Central Asia and Caspian region is blessed with abundant oil and gas that can enhance the lives of the region's residents, and provide energy for growth in both Europe and Asia. The impact of these resources on U.S. commercial interests and U.S. foreign policy is also significant."
U.S. INTERESTS IN THE CENTRAL ASIAN REPUBLICS, HEARING BEFORE THE SUBCOMMITTEE ON ASIA AND THE PACIFIC OF THE COMMITTEE ON INTERNATIONAL RELATIONS, HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES, 12 February 1998 - evidence by Mr. John J. Maresca, vice president of international relations, Unocal Corporation (US oil company)
http://commdocs.house.gov/committees/intlrel/hfa48119.000/hfa48119_0.HTM

Those of you who frequent the foreign policy debate and do a little research into the newly discovered caspien sea oil deposits may be able to make the connection between US foreign policy formation, and decreasing Americas oil dependance on Middle Eastern petroleum exports..........

Which lends even more credence to BBC's report the US did infact PLAN a military offensive in Afghanastan for the purposes of overthrowing the Taliban in late 2001, prior to sept 11th......

US 'planned attack on Taleban'
"A former Pakistani diplomat has told the BBC that the US was planning military action against Osama Bin Laden and the Taleban even before last week's attacks. "
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/south_asia/newsid_1550000/1550366.stm

The US Government, or more aptedly, the Bush Administration, just needed some sort of event to engender massive domestic, and perhaps even global support, for a United States Armed Invasion and Overthrow of the Taliban. They needed some kind of justification to go in there, and secure a new "WEstern Friendly" Government so they could ensure the efficent flow of oil to the American economy and to shore up long term energy objectives.

hmm... as luck would have it, your Senior Government Officials, Both in the Intelligence and Executive Branches of the Government, negleted to inform the nations law enforcement and aviation authority a massive terrorist attack was expected to be carried out on US soil, using highjacked civilian aircraft, in late 2001 -- whose mastermind resided in the KEY country needed to secure the previously unexploitable *massive* Caspien oil reservers!!!!! WOW... TALK ABOUT FUCKING LUCK HERE PEOPLE!!!!

And GOD knows every official comprising GW's Senior Administration is a STRAIGHT SHOOTER, HONEST DUDES.......I mean GWB and Senior only practise insider trading regularly via the Carlyle Group -- Americas 10th largest military defense contractor!!!! Its not like GW, OR THE MAJORITY OF HIS ADMINISTRATION HAVE DEEP CONNECTIONS IN THE OIL INDUSTRY?!? Good lord NO!!! They are good, kind, honest people. So WHAT if George Bushs Grandfather made his millions selling steel to the Nazis during World War 2??? Whats that got to do with anything.


Who benefits from the Sept 11th attacks against the US?

1) American military defense contractors. Carlyle Group is Americas tenth largest military defense contractor with George Bush Jr. and George Bush Snr. receiving firm compensation in exchange for "consultation services". Carlyle Group benefits immensly from the 3 FOLD increase in US military defense spending prompted by the Sept 11th attacks. GW picked the contracts for some of the new defense equipment. GW and Father reep massive payoffs from their new found, and perfectly timed war. Very luck guys at best.

2) American Oil Companies with extraction, pumping, and loading rights for Caspien Oil Reserves. GW and the majority of buddies in his administration are HEAVILY connected with the American oil industry; Rumsfeild, Cheney, Bush......that wouldnt have a darn thing to do with all this, you think1?!

3) As sheer luck would have it, Sept 11th gave the US a greenlight to operate military bases indefinitly in Afghanastan and possibly other Soviet break away republics. Lucky for us, air sorties supported by US military bases located in Afghanaistan and ExSoviet provinces, can also serve the dual purpose of ensuring the efficent flow of oil from the Caspien Sea to Pakistani terminal loading ports in the war torn region of West Asia. Luck luck luck. Man. This guys got a four leaf clover up his fucking ass.

"This is about America's energy security. It's also about preventing strategic inroads by those who don't share our values. We're trying to move these newly independent countries toward the west. We would like to see them reliant on western commercial and political interests rather than going another way. We've made a substantial political investment in the Caspian, and it's very important to us that both the pipeline map and the politics come out right."
http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,3604,438134,00.html
Bill Richardson 1998, US energy secretary, on US policy on the extraction and transport of Caspian oil, quoted in the Guardian 15 February 2001


4) Americas long term national security objectives.
At this point in time, with global public opinion completely supportive of any US military action overseas, the United States Government has the ability to strike ANY foriegn country which exhibit ANY "terrorist" affliation whatsoever.

Think about that single fact for a minute.

Our government no longer needs to provide any evidence proving alledged hostile states are engaged in terrorist activity. All they have to do now, is say " xxx country is engaged in terrorism, and just look what happened Sept 11th!" thats not to say some countries arnt legitmately engaged in supporting terrorism targeting US interests. Saudi Arabia being one. However, you have to acknowledge the dangers inherent in giving the worlds most powerfull government the unfettered ability to label any group or state a terrorist, and then play American emotions like cheap violin to engender civilian support for ANY military activity.

 

[buddy28]

I drive through Newcastle country Del. every day and one day in August before 9/11 I saw massive amounts of troop transports and vehicles going by rail to Dover AFB. Not since the Gulf war or the balkins had that kind of hardware been moving to Dover. A lot of people I know where wondering what was up.

US 'planned attack on Taleban'
"A former Pakistani diplomat has told the BBC that the US was planning military action against Osama Bin Laden and the Taleban even before last week's attacks. "
http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/south_asia/newsid_1550000/1550366.stm

 

[spongebob]

Turkmenistan-Afghanistan-Pakistan pipeline: Unocal

And GOD knows every official comprising GW's Senior Administration is a STRAIGHT SHOOTER, HONEST DUDES.......I mean GWB and Senior only practise insider trading regularly via the Carlyle Group -- Americas 10th largest military defense contractor

1) American military defense contractors. Carlyle Group is Americas tenth largest military defense contractor with George Bush Jr. and George Bush Snr. receiving firm compensation in exchange for "consultation services".

2) American Oil Companies with extraction, pumping, and loading rights for Caspien Oil Reserves. GW and the majority of buddies in his administration are HEAVILY connected with the American oil industry; Rumsfeild, Cheney, Bush......that wouldnt have a darn thing to do with all this, you think1?!

1. hasnt the unocal company pulled out of that project for some time now?

2. insider trading, is it really considered insider trading? can you explain how bush jr. practices insider trading with the carlyle group?

3. carlyle group is now the tenth largest, it was just the 11th. and when did bush jr recieve compensation for consultation?

4. which american oil companies will be doing this and what is the connection with the bush's?

 

[Frackal]

America and the Govt were just as involved in the 9/11 attacks as Osama and his crew was. Dont be fooled.

Thank you

 

[hooch]

The BUSH cronies saying the terrorist threat wasn't specific enough hold less and less water...

from the LA times..


Italy Tells of Threat at Genoa Summit
Plot: Officials there took seriously a report that terrorists would try to crash a plane to kill Bush and other leaders.

From a Times Staff Writer


WASHINGTON -- U.S. and Italian officials were warned in July that Islamic terrorists might attempt to kill President Bush and other leaders by crashing an airliner into the Genoa summit of industrialized nations, officials said Wednesday.

Italian officials took the reports seriously enough to prompt extraordinary precautions during the July summit of the Group of 8 nations, including closing the airspace over Genoa and stationing antiaircraft guns at the city's airport.

But a U.S. official said that American counter-terrorism experts considered the warning "unsubstantiated."

In either case, the reports suggest that Western governments were aware that terrorists might one day use a hijacked airplane as a suicide weapon--as they did Sept. 11 in attacks on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon.

The Genoa warning was disclosed last week by Italian Deputy Prime Minister Gianfranco Fini. In remarks on a television talk show reported by the Italian news agency ANSA, Fini said: "Many people were ironic about the Italian secret services. But in fact they got the information that there was the possibility of an attack against the U.S. president using an airliner. That's why we closed the airspace and installed the missiles. Those who made cracks should now think a little."

An attack on the summit would have endangered not only President Bush, but also British Prime Minister Tony Blair, French President Jacques Chirac, Russian President Vladimir V. Putin and others.

In an interview published Sept. 21 in the French newspaper Le Figaro, Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak said his government provided information to the United States about possible attacks on the Genoa summit by Saudi-born terrorist Osama bin Laden. "There was a question of an airplane stuffed with explosives. As a result, precautions were taken."

White House aides refused to comment on the reports. "We just don't talk about security arrangements," spokeswoman Anna Perez said.

But a U.S. official outside the White House said the Genoa reports were received and discounted.

"There were some press reports citing what we subsequently determined was unsubstantiated information," said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity.

In any case, the possibility of suicide hijackings has been known to U.S. counter-terrorism officials for several years.

On Christmas Eve 1994, Algerian terrorists hijacked an Air France Airbus and planned to blow it up over the Eiffel Tower in Paris. French troops stormed the plane as it was refueling in Marseilles and killed the hijackers.

The hijackers' organization, the Armed Islamic Group, is now believed to be part of Bin Laden's Al Qaeda network.

In 1996, a terrorist captured in Manila told Philippine police that Al Qaeda planned to hijack 11 U.S. airliners simultaneously and to fly a plane into CIA headquarters near Washington.

 

[the nature boy]

The truth is US Intelligence intercepts threats of this kind all the time. 99.9% of the time it turns out to be false information. Just look at all the warnings we have gotten since 9/11. One time the information turned out to be correct. However, the specifics were never known. There is no way that the White House could have justified releasing this information before the 9/11 attacks. Especially considering that this type of terrorism was unprecedented.

sorry I disagree. thre are people that are paid to protect americans and the USA from what happened on 9-11. They didn't do their job. I don't care if you get 100000000000 phony threats, you have to take them all seriously. Why are we paying for them then? They have a job to do. Their job is to follow up on leads no matter how unbelieveable they appear to be.

And they did know specifics, they knew planes would be hijacked.

 

[gymnpoppa]

1. hasnt the unocal company pulled out of that project for some time now?

2. insider trading, is it really considered insider trading? can you explain how bush jr. practices insider trading with the carlyle group?

3. carlyle group is now the tenth largest, it was just the 11th. and when did bush jr recieve compensation for consultation?

4. which american oil companies will be doing this and what is the connection with the bush's?

There was a documentary on this recently....Nightline I believe, search their archives. Unocal pulled out on due to the attacks of Sept 11th.

Halliburton, and Cheney was the company doing the research, planning, etc. Halliburton was also buying oil from Iraq, which cheney, as ceo, claimed to know nothing about.
They aired video of Cheney making his presentation of pipeline plans through Afghanistan, and other possible routes, thru former russian provinces. Which we are trying to circumvent the russians, to cut them out of the oil/money.

That is the connection to bush. Bush named the one guy who was the point of contact before the attacks, to a ambassador post. The recent trips by Rumsfeld, and others to the other countries in the regions are to speak with and discuss deals with the respective governments.


This is the same stuff that Strongchick was posting about, months ago.....same shit.

 

[gymnpoppa]

sorry I disagree. thre are people that are paid to protect americans and the USA from what happened on 9-11. They didn't do their job. I don't care if you get 100000000000 phony threats, you have to take them all seriously. Why are we paying for them then? They have a job to do. Their job is to follow up on leads no matter how unbelieveable they appear to be.

And they did know specifics, they knew planes would be hijacked.

Bush himself said, "we take all threats seriously."

pushing fe
Obviously, we sure are getting the word(publicly) on threats now, whether or not they are true or not, obviously our incompetent intelligence agencies didn't or don't know, nor can they stop them. Many members of Congress have acknowledged, what Bush, Tom ridge, and others in his administration will not. They cannot protect us, another attack is a virtual certainty.

Before Sept 11th, does anyone else recall bush saying that fighting terrorism was on the back burner, way back in February 2001?


I know one thing, the ONLY reason is approval ratings are up is because of the war, which during war time, ratings always go up, no matter who is in office. Prior to Sept 11th, Bush was below normal in polls, about his abilities to do a good job.

I think he should be fervently hoping that WE find bin Laden, because his domestic policies, suck, and because he hasn't found OBL, he now downplays his desire publicly.

 

[spongebob]

There was a documentary on this recently....Nightline I believe, search their archives. Unocal pulled out on due to the attacks of Sept 11th.

Halliburton, and Cheney was the company doing the research, planning, etc. Halliburton was also buying oil from Iraq, which cheney, as ceo, claimed to know nothing about.
They aired video of Cheney making his presentation of pipeline plans through Afghanistan, and other possible routes, thru former russian provinces. Which we are trying to circumvent the russians, to cut them out of the oil/money.

That is the connection to bush. Bush named the one guy who was the point of contact before the attacks, to a ambassador post. The recent trips by Rumsfeld, and others to the other countries in the regions are to speak with and discuss deals with the respective governments.


This is the same stuff that Strongchick was posting about, months ago.....same shit.

1. no i think unocal officially pulled out sometime in 99 or 00'. i will look it back up.

2. yea they were more or less doing a feasibility study. but i dont think halliburton was purchasing oil, they have no refining capabilities. i think they sell equipment for drilling and extraction.

3. what exactly were those trips for?

there were also six or seven other companies involved in that project, all of which are foriegn companies, im not sure if they are continuing on with it.

 

[spongebob]

America and the Govt were just as involved in the 9/11 attacks as Osama and his crew was. Dont be fooled.

well gosh gee willikers, i was fooled and bamboozled, thanks for clearing this up so easily.

 

[spongebob]

one possibility is that the campaigns are starting soon for the Nov. elections, so the Democrats and their supporters in the media might be throwing more of this type of info and/or hype to hurt the Republicans, especially now that the 9/11 mourning period is passed....

thank you.

 

[Daeo]

thing is: if they had intercept the airliners and shot them down, what would the US population think about that ? Thats a pretty hot topic....

Any logical person would understand. What would you rather lose? A couple buildings full of people which contains thousands upon thousands, or a couple plane full of people which contain only hundreds.

I too find it very odd that the planes got as far as they did. The union which I used to work for regularly worked on nuclear power plants. They had men with M-16's, rocket launchers, and attack helicopters on the grounds ready to blow away anything that came within a certain range. They gave a warning, but they didn't fuck around.

You'd think the government would have took some kind of action...

 

[spongebob]

I too find it very odd that the planes got as far as they did. The union which I used to work for regularly worked on nuclear power plants. They had men with M-16's, rocket launchers, and attack helicopters on the grounds ready to blow away anything that came within a certain range. They gave a warning, but they didn't fuck around.

You'd think the government would have took some kind of action...

well when the acting FAA director, monte belger, was supossedly bring all 4000 planes down 'per pilot discretion' even after two planes had already struck the WTC and one struck the pentagon, its not to hard to imagine.

 

[SSAlexSS]

Remember last year ago that golfers (Payne Stewart) private jet crashed because everybody inside passed out from depressurization. Within MINUTES, on an immediate alert from the FAA, U.S. Air Force and
Air Guard jets were scrambled to intercept Stewart's jet and see what
the heck was up (not that it helped much in that case...): "Several Air
Force and Air National Guard fighter jets, plus an AWACS radar control
plane, helped the Federal Aviation Administration track the runaway
Learjet and estimate when it would run out of fuel." --CNN, 10.26.99

Interceptors were in direct proximity to Stewart's seriously messed-up
aircraft within about TEN MINUTES of him having taken off. NOBODY had to
go pull Clinton away from Vice-president Monica Lewinsky and get him to
AUTHORIZE the INTERCEPT of Payne Stewart's jet that day.

Moreover, according to the same CNN article: "...officers on the Joint
Chiefs were monitoring the Learjet on radar screens inside the
Pentagon's National Military Command Center. -- CNN, 10.26.99

Air Traffic Controllers request military intercepts of private and
commercial planes REGULARLY. Sometimes it's because communications have
broken off; sometimes it's to inform a pilot that his plane has gone off
course; other times it's to observe the situation directly - for
instance, to see who's actually flying the plane and things like that.
None of this requires presidential approval.

Fast forward to 9/11. The BUSH Admin has INTEL that US airliners will be hijacked by Al-Quaida (AS they now ADMIT). Then one morning FAA loses contact with FOUR airliners which DRAMATICALLY alter there course, turn off their transponders and head towards NYC and DC. It is another 45-60 minutes before they start slamming into bulidings. In that time frame not ONE US AIR FORCE jet made an intercept. What the fuck???? They can intercept a golfers plane but not one hijacked airliner???

STOP defending BUSH and START asking the GOV'T HOW THIS COULD HAPPEN!!!!!!!! Better yet ask WHY they LET it happen!!!!!

Study hitlers rise to power in 1930s.

Case closed. Bush wins.

 

[Needhelp]

What do you think of some of the info on http://infowars.com/resources.html --To me, some of the articles make a lot of sense...