Need Advice.

[babybodybuilder2.5]

I need to know what you all would do if this was you. To those of you that have read my post know that I am HIV postive and that I have been looking for a job now a very long time.
Here's the deal. Back in October of last year I found out that a postion would be opening up at this hair salon, in Jan of this year. I was told be a few of the Stylist that I should take the job. It would have been an assistant to all the hairdressers. This salon is ran by indepentant stylist. They each rent out thier space. Well they kept putting me off on a decison as to if I would get the job. So, finally one of them took matter into his hands and hired me to work under him alone. Then another stylist decided to use me as well. The other stylist in the salon were all telling me "We're so glad your here ...etc..." I had worked there for a week, when the guy that hired me was called in by the owner. She told him that I could not work there, because he did not ask her first. Which is crap, because they rent their space. Not to mention that all the previous assistances were hired without her consent. She told him that either I go, or she was going to make him leave her salon. It was not long after that we learned that the owner was worried about me being postive. Even though she did not say it directly to anyone, but it was implyed. First the manager told the guy who hired me that the owner was concerend about legal issues with me being there. Then we learned that she asked one of the other stylist what he thought about me working there and me having AIDS? He told here it didn't bother him. Get where I'm going with this? Even though I know you can not get HIV from me, by touching you. I took percausions. I wore gloves when ever I was touching someones hair. That was just to calm the uneducated. Many of the patrons there know of my status. Not one of them complained about me being there.
I want to know if you think that this is discrimination towards me? Would you take this to an attorney for advice?
I really need your advice, and don't hate on me ...please.

 

[*MissFit*]

I would seek council.. but not sure how far it would go

 

[hamstershaver]

damn that sucks, do you want to sue her?

 

[jerseyart]

Sorry man about your troubles.

I dont know how to advise you legally. The owner never hired you, so she didnt fire you. I suppose a case could be made with precedent if other people were allowed their choice of personal assistants etc, but sounds a bit weak.

Truthfully, and with no malice, I completely understand the salon owners stance. I know you think no one had a problem with your presence, but I think you may be being a bit naive. I doubt it was advertised to every customer, and I have no doubt many customers would have quietly found somewhere else to go if they were made aware.

Its not a question of ignorance, but fear. Why risk oneslef in even the most unlikely way if unnecessary. Its a horrible disease, but truthfully I would look for work that doesnt involve direct contact with people in such an intimate way

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

Sorry man about your troubles.

I dont know how to advise you legally. The owner never hired you, so she didnt fire you. I suppose a case could be made with precedent if other people were allowed their choice of personal assistants etc, but sounds a bit weak.

Truthfully, and with no malice, I completely understand the salon owners stance. I know you think no one had a problem with your presence, but I think you may be being a bit naive. I doubt it was advertised to every customer, and I have no doubt many customers would have quietly found somewhere else to go if they were made aware.

Its not a question of ignorance, but fear. Why risk oneslef in even the most unlikely way if unnecessary. Its a horrible disease, but truthfully I would look for work that doesnt involve direct contact with people in such an intimate way

Hey Jersey...I understand your view. It's true that the owner directly did not hire me. She also did not hire the last assistant there. Each hairdresser there has the option to use who they wish. The salon does not directly pay for the assisant. They are paid by tips and directly from each hairdresser that uses them . They are independant contractors that use her shop.
I am not niave, as I have been living with HIV for over 13 years now, so I pretty much know who uneducated our world still remains. You call it fear, but if they knew about the disease then they would know that there is nothing to be afraid of. I have been friends with this salon for over 5 years, and know many of the patrons that come there. It's not like it was kept a secret, people talk, when they should not..know what I mean? ( gossip)
I believe that she singled me out , only because I have HIV, which I believe is illegal. Im almost sure that I would not be the only person in the hair salon business that has HIV.
Thanks for your input, I do appreciate your honesty.

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

I would seek council.. but not sure how far it would go

I'm thinking about doing just that...Thanks....

 

[Lestat]

tricky situation man, the owner is just concerned that your "status" might concern customers and cause a loss in business.

Good luck

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

damn that sucks, do you want to sue her?

Hey Hammy, not sure what I'm going to do at this point. If I do decide to go after her, it would be to show people that you can not discriminate against those living with HIV/AIDS.....yes, the money would be nice too. Maybe then I could pay for all my medical needs.

 

[HumorMe]

tricky situation man, the owner is just concerned that your "status" might concern customers and cause a loss in business.

Good luck

While true she still can not discriminate. It's a hard situation to deal with all the way around.

 

[rnch]

enlist the ACLU and sue the ignorant, narrow minded bitch.

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

While true she still can not discriminate. It's a hard situation to deal with all the way around.

That's why I don't know how to deal with this...it wrong for her to single me out....

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

tricky situation man, the owner is just concerned that your "status" might concern customers and cause a loss in business.

Good luck

The owner does not get money from the Patrons. She gets her money from the stylist that work in her salon. They pay a weelky rental fee. ..

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

enlist the ACLU and sue the ignorant, narrow minded bitch.

I just want her to realize what she did was wrong. I have been pushed around these last few years and I'm tired of letting people walk all over me.
Thanks ....

 

[HumorMe]

Who do you know that would go to bat for you and testify that she specifically said she wanted you out because you were HIV+?

If nobody then...

That would be difficult to prove unless she specifically said it and someone who is reliable could vouch that she said it.

I would seek legal counsel if you are convinced that is what happened.

Let's say you won a court battle to continue to work there. Would you be willing to stay?

 

[chewyxrage]

You should go see a lawyer. You may not have a case at all and I'm sure a lawyer would tell you straight out. If you do have a case then I would pursue it.

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

Who do you know that would go to bat for you and testify that she specifically said she wanted you out because you were HIV+?

If nobody then...

That would be difficult to prove unless she specifically said it and someone who is reliable could vouch that she said it.

I would seek legal counsel if you are convinced that is what happened.

Let's say you won a court battle to continue to work there. Would you be willing to stay?

It's difficult to say if one of them would be willing to step up to bat for me. I do know that the guy who let come to work there would carry the bat into court. I know that they would run the risk of their jobs, and I understand that. Im talking what is morally right. there.)
Would I got back to work there....Yes I would, I loved it.

 

[jerseyart]

I just want her to realize what she did was wrong. I have been pushed around these last few years and I'm tired of letting people walk all over me.
Thanks ....

Bor Im sure you feel put upon, and no doubt you've had legitimate reasons for feeling that way

I just don't think this salon owners actions qualify.

She's running a business, not a social experiment. We can argue back and forth as to the reality and perception of HIV. The fact remains, as you yourself acknowledged, many people have what you call an "ignorance" with respect to the disease.

Its not her job to educate the masses and change public perception. Its her job to run her busniess and pay her debts/employees and try to earn something in addition for herself and her family.

If it were me I would do the same thing. hell, it would likely be more cost effective to pay you to stay home. This woman doesnt owe you a living. She has her own responsibilities which your presence jeopardize.

Im not certain why everyone there is aware of your ailment. But fi this si the only type of work you feel yourself suited to you would make it a lot easier on yourself and others if you made it less public. We all have to live in the real world, as your own misfortune has no doubt taught you only too well friend

 

[bluetwistedsteel67]

This is a tricky situation. I do understand the salon owners point of view but I also understand yours. The salon owner doesn't want to see business drop (even though she rents space out and doesn't feel the pain of less clients being cut/colored, she does feel it on the retail end. Less customers=less product being sold). The reality is that you being there WILL effect business. Right or wrong that is just reality. How many cusomers would go to a salon specifically because there was an HIV+ person working there? None. How many would NOT go to a salon that had an HIV+ person washing their hair or doing other tasks with close, physical contact? Probably quite a few. This is sad and I feel for you because the reason you chose that job was because you like the personal interaction. From your point of view these people have nothing to worry about and don't understand that the odds of you passing AIDS to any customer is nearly zero. The problem here is that you are a man living with AIDS not a business owner trying to stay profitable. Would I let someone with AIDS wash my hair? Yes, no problem. Would I feel differently in choosing a salon to take my son or daughter to? Probably. I just think that this is such an awful disease that peoples fear will never go away. It is a disease that is capable of changing. Could it become more contageous? Maybe, but some people aren't willing to take the chance. As for your desire to possible sue, that is a huge uphill battle. For one thing your case is very shaky against the owner. For two, you were not a high wage earner so in losing the job there is not a ton of compensatory damage afflicted. For three, you will have a very rough time finding a lawyer to take this case on a contingency basis because they are not going to see this as a big money verdict even with a victory. If you were fired from a high paying job and could prove that is was due to your illness you would have a good case but yours is a 1 in 10 case at best. I wish you luck and hope you find a job where you're valued as a person and that brings you great joy.

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

This is a tricky situation. I do understand the salon owners point of view but I also understand yours. The salon owner doesn't want to see business drop (even though she rents space out and doesn't feel the pain of less clients being cut/colored, she does feel it on the retail end. Less customers=less product being sold). The reality is that you being there WILL effect business. Right or wrong that is just reality. How many cusomers would go to a salon specifically because there was an HIV+ person working there? None. How many would NOT go to a salon that had an HIV+ person washing their hair or doing other tasks with close, physical contact? Probably quite a few. This is sad and I feel for you because the reason you chose that job was because you like the personal interaction. From your point of view these people have nothing to worry about and don't understand that the odds of you passing AIDS to any customer is nearly zero. The problem here is that you are a man living with AIDS not a business owner trying to stay profitable. Would I let someone with AIDS wash my hair? Yes, no problem. Would I feel differently in choosing a salon to take my son or daughter to? Probably. I just think that this is such an awful disease that peoples fear will never go away. It is a disease that is capable of changing. Could it become more contageous? Maybe, but some people aren't willing to take the chance. As for your desire to possible sue, that is a huge uphill battle. For one thing your case is very shaky against the owner. For two, you were not a high wage earner so in losing the job there is not a ton of compensatory damage afflicted. For three, you will have a very rough time finding a lawyer to take this case on a contingency basis because they are not going to see this as a big money verdict even with a victory. If you were fired from a high paying job and could prove that is was due to your illness you would have a good case but yours is a 1 in 10 case at best. I wish you luck and hope you find a job where you're valued as a person and that brings you great joy.

If I allow her to get away with this, then I'm giving into to what everyone belives. That a person with HIV should keep it a secret and not intermingle with those that aren't infected. Why should I care about her lively hood. When she doesn't care about mine? Nor does the United States Government.
It's not about the money as I stated in a previous post. It's about what's right and wrong.

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

WOW....I was a little afraid of posting this. To everyone that posted I say "Thank You" ...I have so much to think about.... what to do , what to do ?????....

 

[bluetwistedsteel67]

Well I don't know this woman so I don't know that she doesn't care about your livlihood. More likely she just cares MORE about her own than she does yours. Just take my advice and don't spend any of your own money to fight this. You are not going to change her and no court is going to force her to re-hire you. It's just a shitty situation and who knows, maybe it's one that even she has a hard time figuring out her own feelings about. Now, I don't have a problem with gays or people with HIV but I am a believer that you should be able to hire people that you choose regardless of the reason. If I were a bigot and didn't like African American people that is my business and I should not be forced to hire them. Likewise, if I were black and wanted to only hire blacks that should be my choice as well. There are people who have religeous beliefs that would cause them to look at your lifestyle unfavorably and they SHOULD be able to refrain from hiring you into the business that they own if they so choose. It's a fine line though, choice/discrimination. I would not hire someone that I believed was anti semetic even though I'm not Jewish. Is that discrimination? Yes, but I don't really care. I don't want to associate with or be near somebody that is full of bigotry. The problem is we can't steer this in a direction of right/wrong. We are either free to hire who we want or we're not.

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

Well I don't know this woman so I don't know that she doesn't care about your livlihood. More likely she just cares MORE about her own than she does yours. Just take my advice and don't spend any of your own money to fight this. You are not going to change her and no court is going to force her to re-hire you. It's just a shitty situation and who knows, maybe it's one that even she has a hard time figuring out her own feelings about. Now, I don't have a problem with gays or people with HIV but I am a believer that you should be able to hire people that you choose regardless of the reason. If I were a bigot and didn't like African American people that is my business and I should not be forced to hire them. Likewise, if I were black and wanted to only hire blacks that should be my choice as well. There are people who have religeous beliefs that would cause them to look at your lifestyle unfavorably and they SHOULD be able to refrain from hiring you into the business that they own if they so choose. It's a fine line though, choice/discrimination. I would not hire someone that I believed was anti semetic even though I'm not Jewish. Is that discrimination? Yes, but I don't really care. I don't want to associate with or be near somebody that is full of bigotry. The problem is we can't steer this in a direction of right/wrong. We are either free to hire who we want or we're not.

All I can say is ...How very sad for you... people like you make the world a difficult place to be happy.

 

[Growth&Courage]

Well I don't know this woman so I don't know that she doesn't care about your livlihood. More likely she just cares MORE about her own than she does yours. Just take my advice and don't spend any of your own money to fight this. You are not going to change her and no court is going to force her to re-hire you. It's just a shitty situation and who knows, maybe it's one that even she has a hard time figuring out her own feelings about. Now, I don't have a problem with gays or people with HIV but I am a believer that you should be able to hire people that you choose regardless of the reason. If I were a bigot and didn't like African American people that is my business and I should not be forced to hire them. Likewise, if I were black and wanted to only hire blacks that should be my choice as well. There are people who have religeous beliefs that would cause them to look at your lifestyle unfavorably and they SHOULD be able to refrain from hiring you into the business that they own if they so choose. It's a fine line though, choice/discrimination. I would not hire someone that I believed was anti semetic even though I'm not Jewish. Is that discrimination? Yes, but I don't really care. I don't want to associate with or be near somebody that is full of bigotry. The problem is we can't steer this in a direction of right/wrong. We are either free to hire who we want or we're not.

The above post brings a mixture of weird responses within me.
It's thoughtful of you to have considered this matter from her (the employer's interpersonal dilemma)
"maybe it's one that even she has a hard time figuring out her own feelings about". Strangely considerate of you to do so.

Also with this advice: " Just take my advice, don't spend any of your own money to fight this. You are not going to change her and no court is going to force her to re-hire you"

The more I think about it, the more I think of this being an ironic comment, coming from you.

On the other hand, I could not possibly overlooked your bold attitude of choice/discrimination here. You mentioned:

"It's a fine line though, choice/discrimination"

But something tells me that it's always discrimination for you though.

And you conclude your arguments as a matter choice & free will as supposed to a matter of right/wrong.

You've left me speechless with the conclusion.

What does everyone else thinks of this post? I'd like to hear peeps from different perspectives.

 

[Growth&Courage]

Babybodybuilder,

My bad..I had totally forgotten about your post.
Look, don't get too emotional or passive with this issue.


It is the reality, one that you're living it in now whether you like it or not.
"Happy" and "difficult" are subjective words. Try not to let it control your perception of the issue.


Eventhough I have mixed views, quite an ambivalent one I might add, but still you will need to move on and pursue another career/job that doesn't impose the same problem here.

You'll be right bro.

 

[babybodybuilder2.5]

Babybodybuilder,

My bad..I had totally forgotten about your post.
Look, don't get too emotional or passive with this issue.


It is the reality, one that you're living it in now whether you like it or not.
"Happy" and "difficult" are subjective words. Try not to let it control your perception of the issue.


Eventhough I have mixed views, quite an ambivalent one I might add, but still you will need to move on and pursue another career/job that doesn't impose the same problem here.

You'll be right bro.

G&C...
I know I will be alright in the end. When I read peoples post and they say things like "it's their choice to do this and that"... It just gets under my skin. Even though there are laws put into place for certain reasons. If we went around doing what we thought was right then everything would be a real mess. I feel it's my right according to the law to fight this woman. even if she is only a small business owner. She is a business that hires people to make her living. Therefore she must also obey the laws. Why should it matter if she only has 6 employees rather than 600. The law is the law..no matter what. I guess I'm in the minority when it comes to right and wrong.
Think about it like this , what if Martin Lurther King had gave up his fight at the very start?
HIV/AIDS people are discriminated all the time. For example : here in Atlanta this week on the new was a postive man who had cancer and lost an ear. He is now sueing the hospital and the doctor . The reason, they will not give him an artifical one to replace the one that he lost from cancer. According to him, they told him that they were not going to run the risk of their staff with him being infected ...who's right in that circumstance. See it's a matter of right verses wrong .
I can't let this go till an attorney tells me other wise. It may not go my way, but at least it will make her think differenlty about her actions.

Sorry to go on about this...I'm standing my ground....

 

[bluetwistedsteel67]

G&C...
I know I will be alright in the end. When I read peoples post and they say things like "it's their choice to do this and that"... It just gets under my skin. Even though there are laws put into place for certain reasons. If we went around doing what we thought was right then everything would be a real mess. I feel it's my right according to the law to fight this woman. even if she is only a small business owner. She is a business that hires people to make her living. Therefore she must also obey the laws. Why should it matter if she only has 6 employees rather than 600. The law is the law..no matter what. I guess I'm in the minority when it comes to right and wrong.
Think about it like this , what if Martin Lurther King had gave up his fight at the very start?
HIV/AIDS people are discriminated all the time. For example : here in Atlanta this week on the new was a postive man who had cancer and lost an ear. He is now sueing the hospital and the doctor . The reason, they will not give him an artifical one to replace the one that he lost from cancer. According to him, they told him that they were not going to run the risk of their staff with him being infected ...who's right in that circumstance. See it's a matter of right verses wrong .
I can't let this go till an attorney tells me other wise. It may not go my way, but at least it will make her think differenlty about her actions.

Sorry to go on about this...I'm standing my ground....

I applaud you for your desire to stand up for yourself. My point with "letting this go" is as follows.:
You go to an attorney and explain your case. The attorney AGREES with you. The women discriminated against you due to your illness. The attorney then makes a decision. Does he take the case on a contingency or does he require a retainer and have you pay as the case progresses. This is not a big verdict case. This is not even a medium verdict case. Maybe it should be but that facts are not on your side (for a big award). It is not a high paying position, you were not in the position for very long and she has some wiggle-room in her reasons for firing you. NO attorney is going to take this on a contingency. You are going to have to "foot the bill". Do you have the means or desire to pay $100 per hour minimum to persue this. You could very easily be out 10-20k before you hardly blink and end up with nothing. Many states havevery specific "at will" employment regulations. Ca, where I live is one example. At will employment means that an employer does not need any reason to fire you just as you don't need any reason to quit. In my prior email I wrote that this is a touchy issue. Because although I loathe descrimination I do like personal freedoms. My example of an anti-semite was just the example I chose to use. It cuts both ways. Should I be forced to allow somebody to work in my business that I know is a member of the klu klux klan if he's in fact qualified to do the job? How about if I ran a religeos based private elementary shool (I don't by the way) and one oth the beliefs I shared with those sending their children to the school was that homosexuality was wrong and a sin. Should I be forced to hire a homosexual if he/she were qualified for the position? The beautiful thing about our country is that we get to believe whatever we want. That doesn't mean that everyone has to agree with us or even go along. Lets say I worked for the ACLU and they found out that I was involved in something contrary to the ACLU standard. Would they be forced to keep me and not "descriminate" against me for my beliefs. The bottom line bro is I wish you the best and you probably deserve better than the treatment you've received but the business belongs to this woman and if she doesn't want you there for any reason you shouldn't be there.