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My Oral Fina Experience

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UbermenscH

New member
Ok after reading some of the Oral Fina arguements here and on a few other board. I decided to give it a try. This will be my first cycle in over 10 years when i did a cycle of deca and test.
I have been lifting for the past 3 years again and have made some good progress. I have been stuck at my present bodyweight for about a year now. I weigh 180 right now and am 5'10" and 38 years old. I will be taking 240 mg of fina oraly and using 10 units of humalin R with 100 grms of dextrose post workout. I will keep my protien at 300grm a day and carbs around 200 to 250 I will use healthy fats to make up the diff.
I know many will say that all I need to do is eat more and i would grow. I know this, each winter i bulk and was at 220 lbs on xmas day. But each time i cut back down i only net about 3 lbs of gain. My goal is to try and gain about 10 to 12 lbs with little or no fat gain. This cycle will run 10 weeks and end with 3 weeks of clomid.

Here is a link to my before pics.
http://photos.yahoo.com/bc/ksharpe64/lst?.dir=/before&.view=t

any input would be welcome
 
I'd say 240m is a little over kill. 160-200 should be plenty if you take it properly. I got good results from 160mg/day split into 2 doses. You should easily be able to gain 10-12 lbs of lean mass in 10 weeks...maybe even 6-8 if you lift hard and eat well. If you want to get the most out of it i wouldn't be too concerned about fat gain...eat fairly clean but big. You're bound to put on a little fat, but that can easily be cut later...don't sacrifice lean gains because you're concerned about a little fat...it comes with the territory.

Keep us posted on your progress.

JoBu
 
one guys was taking 20 pellets a day thinking they were 10mg each and was really taking 400mg a day at 20mg a pellet. :D wasn't me of course. :dodgy: i am still debating on how many to take this time around...coming up in two weeks i switch from winny to finaoral/EQ on this cycle. i think 6-8 is too little. i feel at least 10, maybe 12 a day is best. but depends on absorbtion. so who the hell knows.
 
Whatever daily dosage you decide to stay at...

Spread it out as much as possible.

Oral doses 'spike' and then fade quickly in the system. The more you spread it, the better your results will be. Many small doses is better than one or two bigger doses.
 
Last summer during an injectable hiatus....I consumed 7-9 pellets a day...via a pill crusher...grapefuit juice as an appetizer...and holding under the tongue until mostly gone.....I am a rather big dude already....and had mad gains....went from 261 @ 13% to 250-252 @ 8%...was very pleased....10 weeks of fina.....no clomid...just .5 mg og Arimidex every day.....my arms looked like a map of the U.S. Interstate System....not to mention my strength was through the roof...and this is from a guy who has done it all and recptor sites should be numb to most anything....needless to say I am doing a maintenance cycle of 500 mg of QV Enantat 250...and 400 mgs of QV EQ for 8-10 weeks..and will most likely eat Fina all summer......he he he....:D
 
What is this grapefruit juice thing? Also any more opinions on the one or two big dose a day vs several small doses spread out through the day? I just started today with my first doses so any input on the most efficent way (not injection) to use this. of course i know that injection is the best but for my own reasons i dont want to right now.......Daily insulin injects is enough...
 
Purely theoretical here, but trying to help.

I would think that to maximize absorption, I would crush or chew the tabs and keep them in your mouth as long as possible, hopefully until they fully dissolve. This way they will be absorbed into the membranes within your mouth, and available rather quickly and efficiently into the bloodstream.

Frankly I think even with all of the people that knock oral Fina, that this type of administration is probably quite good.

Now just eating the pellets - swallowing them whole or crushed, will probably make them far less available for real absorption and use.

Grapefruit is mentioned because it helps with increasing the effectiveness of some orals. Which ones and under which circumstances I don’t know, I have read of people drinking it with winny and while taking dbol.

I would think though in this instance it would be less of an issue and certainly if you use the mouth-absorption method like I first stated, the grapefruit juice is probably not required.

You know, . again ...... I really think that crushing the tabs and placing them in your mouth probably has a much much higher efficiency, probably only second to injection.

I wonder of this might hurt gums though.

As for doses during the day, I don’t know, no one has done like a blood concentration study of the substance when administered in these ways. But I would guess we are talking about an ester-less substance when taken in these ways, so I would spread the tabs out as much as possible throughout the day.
 
Just finished my oral fina...for some reason I like to spend more time on my front lawn now, trotting around and chewing that kentucky bluegrass?? Maybe I need some clomid?
 
Dial_tone said:
I still think that if you're dead set against injecting Fina transdermal spray is more elegant way of doing it. The pellets burn in your mouth and taste terrible. Drink a diet coke after having some pellets in your mouth and it will really light up.
Click to expand...

just water makes it like fireworks in my mouth for me post oral fina. no diet soda needed thank you. :D
 
I would think that to maximize absorption, I would crush or chew the tabs and keep them in your mouth as long as possible, hopefully until they fully dissolve. This way they will be absorbed into the membranes within your mouth, and available rather quickly and efficiently into the bloodstream.

Frankly I think even with all of the people that knock oral Fina, that this type of administration is probably quite good.

Now just eating the pellets - swallowing them whole or crushed, will probably make them far less available for real absorption and use.

******************************Remember the trenbolone in pellets has an acetate ester attached, and the resultant compound is lipophillic, and that means sublingual administration isn't theoretically feasible. In addition according to Patrick Arnold the oral bioavailability of trenbolone is quite high, search the supps. board for his comments on this.
 
I would think that to maximize absorption, I would crush or chew the tabs and keep them in your mouth as long as possible, hopefully until they fully dissolve. This way they will be absorbed into the membranes within your mouth, and available rather quickly and efficiently into the bloodstream.

Frankly I think even with all of the people that knock oral Fina, that this type of administration is probably quite good.

Now just eating the pellets - swallowing them whole or crushed, will probably make them far less available for real absorption and use.

******************************Remember the trenbolone in pellets has an acetate ester attached, and the resultant compound is lipophillic, and that means sublingual administration isn't theoretically feasible. In addition according to Patrick Arnold the oral bioavailability of trenbolone is quite high, search the supps. board for his comments on this.
 
I would like to see that post by Patrick. I have a lot of respect for him as a chemist and general expert.

This is the second time I've seen the comment in the last few weeks that the acetate ester is a significant barrier to absorption.

I don't agree. Trenbolone Acetate has a molecular weight of 314 and the log(P) is 3.4. It's a very good choice for transdermal/sublingual. I've also seen plenty of evidence that its very effective as a transdermal and I've seen many reports of sublingual q

Having said that, I suspect that TA is very oral available but I haven't been able to find proof. However, the problem is how quickly the body metabolizes oral TA. The blood levels spike quickly and then quickly fade. Leaving a very short period of usable blood levels. A transdermal, inject or sublingual application provide for more sustained levels of TA in the blood stream.

Sublingual provides for slower absorption, though its reportedly not a pleasant experience. (Never tried it.)

Regarding the Grapefruit juice. It does reduce the effectiveness of a certain enzyme(s) that is used in breaking down certain medications. While we know how Trenbolone Acetate is metabolized in the system, we don't know what enzyme(s) are responsible. If grapefruit juice does affect an enzyme responsible for breaking down TA, it would improve the effectiveness of oral TA.

A couple of years ago, one person reported keeping their tablets mixed in with their chew between their cheek and gums. They reported excellent gains.

Riker is pretty much dead on in what he wrote and I, of course, agree with Dial about transdermal.
 
I know its way early for any kind of update, only 3 days into cycle.
I have not weighed myself as i was only going to do that once a week. The only think i have to report is workouts seem much more focused. I have been taking 12 pellets a day broken down into 2 pellets 6 times a day. I let them sit in my mouth for as long as possible (up to 45 mins). I know its not much of an update.
Oh and i have wood often. HMMMM.
I wanted to thank every one for the input so far. I was expecting many of the same old "why dont you just inject" comments.
 
UbermenscH said:
I know its way early for any kind of update, only 3 days into cycle.
I have not weighed myself as i was only going to do that once a week. The only think i have to report is workouts seem much more focused. I have been taking 12 pellets a day broken down into 2 pellets 6 times a day. I let them sit in my mouth for as long as possible (up to 45 mins). I know its not much of an update.
Oh and i have wood often. HMMMM.
I wanted to thank every one for the input so far. I was expecting many of the same old "why dont you just inject" comments.
Click to expand...

Why don't you just inject?
 
Since eating fina is contraversial in itself. I will though another one out there.
I NEVER TRAIN NOR HAVE I EVER TRAINED ARMS......
and if you look at my pics they are 17.5 inches. at 180 lbs. in my opinion training arms is a waist of time and recovery ablilty.
The only time my arms get hit is during chest and back training when im doing chins rows and presses. NO i dont have great arms naturaly. they just have grown fine with out any direct work.
 
UbermenscH said:
Since eating fina is contraversial in itself. I will though another one out there.
I NEVER TRAIN NOR HAVE I EVER TRAINED ARMS......
and if you look at my pics they are 17.5 inches. at 180 lbs. in my opinion training arms is a waist of time and recovery ablilty.
The only time my arms get hit is during chest and back training when im doing chins rows and presses. NO i dont have great arms naturaly. they just have grown fine with out any direct work.
Click to expand...

Eating fina isn't controversial... just a well known and remarkably inefficient way to use the drug.

The absorption rate compared to injection is speculated to be around 20% or so.
 
UbermenscH said:
I know its way early for any kind of update, only 3 days into cycle.
I have not weighed myself as i was only going to do that once a week. The only think i have to report is workouts seem much more focused. I have been taking 12 pellets a day broken down into 2 pellets 6 times a day. I let them sit in my mouth for as long as possible (up to 45 mins). I know its not much of an update.
Oh and i have wood often. HMMMM.
I wanted to thank every one for the input so far. I was expecting many of the same old "why dont you just inject" comments.
Click to expand...

Sounds like you're doing it right. Other's who've followed similar protocols have seen good results.

As for the "why don't ya..." crowd, you're still spending less than what many spend on pro-hormones and you'll see better results.

Good luck!
 
update

After about a week im up 4 lbs. Animal in the gym. weights going up on all lifts. OH and Acne. HOW NICE. 38 years old and pimples.
:mad:
 
As far as the absorption rate goes it differs in everyone.....up to 70%....and unless you are just swallowing them it will never be as low as 20%....as far as the why you don't inject people......shit I have been slamming needles in my ass for the past 9 to 10 years....and if I can...and do get great results from eating my fina....then that's what I'm gonna do....besides..it seems to give me some psychological rush....right after I eat them....I always eat em right before a workout.... I let them absorb on the way to the gym.....now about this not training arms thing......if your happy with 17.5", then I guess there is no need to train them....I tape out at 22.5"....of course I weigh in at 252-269...but i know if I didn't train em...I'd be lucky to squeeze out 19".....just a thought.....:p
 
pitbullstl said:
As far as the absorption rate goes it differs in everyone.....up to 70%....and unless you are just swallowing them it will never be as low as 20%....as far as the why you don't inject people......shit I have been slamming needles in my ass for the past 9 to 10 years....and if I can...and do get great results from eating my fina....then that's what I'm gonna do....besides..it seems to give me some psychological rush....right after I eat them....I always eat em right before a workout.... I let them absorb on the way to the gym.....now about this not training arms thing......if your happy with 17.5", then I guess there is no need to train them....I tape out at 22.5"....of course I weigh in at 252-269...but i know if I didn't train em...I'd be lucky to squeeze out 19".....just a thought.....:p
Click to expand...

You will not get 70% absortion rate by eating the fina pellets... much less than that would survive the digestive system.
 
sorry not true....I have done 75 mg of injectable tren eod......and 140 mgs of oral fina eod.....and got much better results from the oral.....I have done this beta test 6 times now.......I am tired of all of the regurgitated facts, and generalizations on this board.....
 
here we go again....facts blah...facts facts facts....blah blah blah......I am only speaking of personal knowledge.....how in fact Fina does break down in my body......like I said.....the test has been run 6 times now......75 mg injectable eod....and 140 mgs. of oral eod.....and the results were far superior orally.....all 6 times.......GOT FINA?
 
pitbullstl said:
here we go again....facts blah...facts facts facts....blah blah blah......I am only speaking of personal knowledge.....how in fact Fina does break down in my body......like I said.....the test has been run 6 times now......75 mg injectable eod....and 140 mgs. of oral eod.....and the results were far superior orally.....all 6 times.......GOT FINA?
Click to expand...

Again, I think that a lot of guys, even in the past several posts in this thread, are talking apples vs oranges.

Pit - when you say Oral - are you talking swallowing them whole, or are you talking crushing them in your mouth and letting them like be absorbed into your gums?
 
Last edited:
always crushed to a fine powder......grapefruit juice as an appetizer...and they stay in my mouth until dissolved...usually about 12-15 minutes.......the burning doesn't bother me...it actually pumps me up before a workout...:p
 
quite aware...but for generalization purposes I'll call it oral.....either way....the comparison and contrast was to injecting vs. oral (or sublingual)and actually it's only sublingual if done under the tongue....I switch it up from the gums to the cheek to the tongue....so like I said I'll call it oral......at any rate the availiability has never been 20%...and positively never 10%
 
I think the point Dial was making, similar to what I said earlier, is that just swallowing whole tabs (or even chewing them, the key is they basically go into the stomach) is a LOT different than allowing them to be absorbed in your mouth (under the tongue, at the cheek, on the gum, whereever).

I am not a stickler for terminology but in this case I think Dial has a good point. When we discuss using Tren like this, we DO need to make this distinction so that we understand what is being talked about.

I would think (just hypothetical here) that simply swallowing the tabs may have very LOW absorption,

And taking them sublingually (or any variation thereof) might be MUCH more effictent.

And before some smart-ass chimes in, yes, we know that injecting is more efficient than either method. Thank You.
 
Does anyone here have any experience making a cyclodextrin complex? Here is a link to some instructions: http://www.mindandmuscle.net/content/page-29.html and another: http://www.betadexcyclodextrin.com/html/2.html

If the cyclodextrin is dissolved in water, and the tren is dissolved in a small amount of alcohol, the alcohol could be slowly added to the water while the mixture is stirred. I guess it could be left to dry or recrystallized and filtered (by heating while mixing, then putting the solution in an ice bath), though I am no chemist.
 
pitbullstl said:
sorry not true....I have done 75 mg of injectable tren eod......and 140 mgs of oral fina eod.....and got much better results from the oral.....I have done this beta test 6 times now.......I am tired of all of the regurgitated facts, and generalizations on this board.....
Click to expand...

Yea- screw the facts.
 
update

12 days into cycle
up 9 lbs . all lifts seem easy and weights going up well.
noodle limp. got some help with that its ok now.
veiny as hell. pretty damn happy so far.
do seem kinda lazy and tired all the time.
been eating clean but lots.
 
My bodybuilding friends and I were going to Cattle Feed stores 10 years ago and buying finaplix, we crushed 7 to10 pellets up ed and put them in a spoon, added Everclear(pure grain alcohol) and heat slightly in till dissolved then drank slowly. Years later I heard about these kits and did a cycle, 150mg eod and didn't see any different gains then when I took it orally.
 
update

just a quick update
today PR on squats 375 x 5 reps before i barely got one rep.
I squat onto a 14 inch high wooden box so my ass hits the box each rep. good and deep. oh and im within a buffet of 200 lbs.
 
update

All PRs shattered. Im happy. but im considering ordering a kit.
Why? not because of results. its because if i inject i have enough fina to finish this cycle and two more 8 weekers. If i do convert and inject it will be due to money.....I am happy right now though.
 
Good to see you'r happy with the results. There is a lot of mis-communication on the boards about fina and the "oral" method. Swallowing them whole is a complete waste IMO. If you do it right you can get good results. i just made my first batch of home brew and can't wait to take a poke :D Only reason I'm injecting this time is cause I want to add a little test for shits and giggles.

Good luck...keep us updated.

JoBu
 
i'm doing 100mg injected M/W/Fmorn/SATnight and oral powdered in the gums on the 3 off days. 10 pellets ED to keep it more constant. figured i had enough liquid for EOD for 6 weeks and just enough pellets for oral to fill in the off days. so economically it worked out good. only on day 4 though. oh and BTW: personal experience doesn't apply here, only the "facts", lol pitbull....don't let these guys get under your skin. they do it to everyone, know-it-alls. :rolleyes: oral works.
 
Freakzilla.....They don't get under my skin.....fact is I'm pretty sure with 9 shows under my belt, and more injections than I could ever remember, not to mention 6 years of hardcore competitive powerlifting, I've probably done more gear than most people on the board....People seem to think that a there is a correaltion between the number of posts someone makes and their knowledge of gear.....fact is what works in one body may not work in all....but the basis for my arguments has been determined by years of use and variance thereof. So all who knock oral fina, uh don't eat em. It's just that simple. Personally my ass, and quads and delts and tri's have been a pin cushion for the last 11 years, so if I can get great results from an oral dosing of Finaplix....that's the way it's gonna be......keep eating those fina..mooooooooo!!!!!.....uh excuse me...pellets. Peace. :p
 
pitbullstl said:
Freakzilla.....They don't get under my skin.....fact is I'm pretty sure with 9 shows under my belt, and more injections than I could ever remember, not to mention 6 years of hardcore competitive powerlifting, I've probably done more gear than most people on the board....People seem to think that a there is a correaltion between the number of posts someone makes and their knowledge of gear.....fact is what works in one body may not work in all....but the basis for my arguments has been determined by years of use and variance thereof. So all who knock oral fina, uh don't eat em. It's just that simple. Personally my ass, and quads and delts and tri's have been a pin cushion for the last 11 years, so if I can get great results from an oral dosing of Finaplix....that's the way it's gonna be......keep eating those fina..mooooooooo!!!!!.....uh excuse me...pellets. Peace. :p
Click to expand...

i hear ya. and BTW: i'm the official licker of stacy keiblers ass crack. so stay out of there! :FRlol:
 
You bastard.....did ya see her on Raw tonight? My girlfriend has an outfit like that.....soemhow it just doesn't seem the same on her though...:p
 
pitbullstl said:
You bastard.....did ya see her on Raw tonight? My girlfriend has an outfit like that.....soemhow it just doesn't seem the same on her though...:p
Click to expand...

yes, she was very lovely. ;)
 
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