Interesting herniated disk / tren/prop experience - any docs around?

[newpump]

Just thought I would share some interesting stuff that I have noticed about a "chronic" condition that I have that makes me more incline to get herniated disks in my lower back. Apparently I have slightly worn vertibra in my lower back. I learned about this after I injured myself (badly) in the gym a few years ago. TUrns out that I had "mushroomed" 2 disks in my lower back (learned about this after an MRI). It left me unable to train for quite a while, and never "fully" healed. After the injury, I could always "feel" a sensation (not really pain, just knew something was wrong) in the area that I injured. I began training again about 9 months after the accident and occasionally I "re-excited" the condition and have been off my feet for a week or 2 to recover. Up untill this summer, I have been "fully natural" (no cycles ever). I made enough progress with my training/diet that I decided to try a tren/prop cycle at 75Mg tren/100 Mg prop EOD. In about the 4th week of the cycle, I noticed that my back felt COMPLETELY HEALED. I hadn't felt this good since before the accident!! I was able to train heavier and harder than ever before without re-injuring the disks. During post cycle, I kept my insane levels of training up (in retrospect probably not a great idea - but it was my FIRST cycle, and I was paranoid about losing the gains). I ended up re-injuring the area slightly again, taking me out for 3 weeks. After waiting for the "time off = time on" rule, I started another cycle. Again, in about week 4 - the back is "fully" healed. I'm going to train hard but sensibly in PCT this time, in an attempt to NOT re-injure the back... but it seems like this cycleing is helping me to "heal" from an injury that all of the docs that I have visited told me I'd probably have for the rest of my life. Does anyone more knowledgable than me have any idea WTF is going on? I'm thinking about trying to have an MRI to see what is going on back there (pardon the pun ) - but if this truely is strengthening my back supporting muscles, or helping in some other way, it is a SHAME that medical science isn't researching this for patients like me!! Sorry for the long winded post, but I know that there are other bros out there like me with this condition, and I'm curious if anyone else has experienced this?!?!

 

[Seth28]

Well whats probably happening is that the time you are on cycle, you are retaining water in the nucleus propulsa (gelatinous inner portion of disc, versus the annulus the outer dougnut of the disc thats more fibrous) and this in a sense this is TEMPORARLY increasing the space between the vertebrae and helping to open of the spinal foramen where the spinal nerves come out (these nerve roots are usuall whats pinched) This is why you are seeing relief on cycle and a flare afterword. You still have the bulging disc during your cycle just not enough to pinch the nerve root, so go easy on it and dont do more than you would do without it, because you will make it worse.

PS if it is a chronic problem and you have tried PT and blocks, then it may be time for surgery. Once the nerve has been compressed long enough and severe enough, you may not regain lost function, even with surgery.

 

[Zyglamail]

First its important to under stand why the disks are herniated. Think of the disk as a jelly filled doughnut between the top of one pop can and the bottom of another (pop cans = vertibra, jelly filled doughnut = disk). The job of the disk is to evenly distribute the load from one vertibra down to the next, if an injury occures and the spin gets pull out of line and the edge of one disk presses down on another it can force the disk out of place.

When that happens, the disk is NOT the problem, the problem is that the tendons/ligaments stabilizing the two vertibra can no longer keep them properly aligned and the uneven weight distribution causes the disk to herniate. Fixing the stretched tendons/ligaments with fix the problem and the disk will fix itself in most cases.

 

[Seth28]

I beg to differ that the disc isnt the problem, yes some of the supporting structures weaken (notably the posterior longitudinal ligament) But if the disc itself isnt the problem then why even bother taking out the disc during a discectomy? why, because the annulus is degenerated, and it is a fibrocartilagenous structure that does NOT display alot of elasticity, hence once its herniated, it tends to stay herniated. TRUST ME I KNOW THIS, if stretching will fix all these disc problems there would be no use for 90% of the spinal surgeries performed (laminectomy/ discectomy). I have seen nsaids and PT work in some cases but when they dont respond to that and or spinal blocks then its time to heal with steel

 

[Generic MALE]

The jelly inside the discs is a material called nucleus pulposis. It is made primarily of a protein (albumin) which is designed to hold water. The gelatin we eat is a protein that binds with water in a similar fashion.

Loss of the protein causes a thinning of the disc. AS increases protein synthesis.

I am middle aged. I first tried AS when an MD put me on testo and HGH. I had severely degenerated discs in my low back. My back felt fantastic in weeks, best in years. I also grew almost an inch in height which I have not lost. I actually think this "growth" was a increase in disc hieght from increased intradiscal "jelly"

 

[newpump]

Interesting replies guys - thank you all for the input! I'm going to keep a CLOSE watch on my progress in post cycle this time. Kepp in mind guys, that I did NOT re-injure the disk until about 6 weeks AFTER my cycle was over (and I think tren/prop water is out of the system by then) - so I'm thinking if I wasn't such an IDIOT with MEGA-squats in post cycle, I may have not re-injured the disk at all. Seth, I know this isn't exactly a scientificly based assumption, just an experience based one, but this leads me to believe that water retention isn't the only thing going on here. Was your disk problem perminently fixed generic (BTW I'm in my 30's )? I haven't tried growth hormone yet, just tren/prop, but this is REALLY amazing for me. I can do things and bend/move in ways that I really have NOT been able to do since the injury! Keep the replies coming guys!!

 

[Generic MALE]

Was your disk problem perminently fixed generic (BTW I'm in my 30's )?

Nothing in the body is permenant, but here I am about 5 years after doing that first "cycle" under my MD and my back is strong. I am still an inch taller. However L5/S1 is still a weak link. Occassionally I will sit down wrong and my lowback muscles will spasm and be very painful for a few days.