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Flah's Opinion on Music
- Thread starter Flah
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Hillmachine
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Korn!
Flah
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Korn: Found a niche and stuck with it, I'll give them that. Everything pales in comparison to their debut, which isn't saying much for some people. Subsequent albums were marred by trying to be both commercial and anti-commercial; pop rock hooks laboring over tired funk metal. I think they're a tad insincere come '06 since the lyrics and feelings of alienation don't apply anymore but the fact that they were aware enough to change their sound and grow (I just used the word "grow" in relation to Korn, wow) in a different direction is admirable for a band that seemed so set in their ways. I'm not going to deny that I find about 40-50% of their debut listenable since the band sounds so hungry and desperate, something they'd lose real quickly. It kind of validates the message they're trying to push. Everything else is a tired rehash on the same song which wasn't that great to begin with. Davis's lyrics are atrocious, appealing to only the dimmest teenager without a life plan (How did, "You better suck my dick and fucking like it," become a rallying cry?) but it did build them a large fan base, so what do I know. Ultimately, there's a whole slew of bands that do the rap/metal combination better (Biohazard, even E-Town Concrete if you want to go in a more hardcore route), but Korn did find their audience and were the "baddest/hardest" thing in the mainstream until Slipknot surfaced. Korn is like a gateway drug for most people, it's there to get you into stuff that's more specific and you'll like more. Just like weed though, a lot of people stuck with it and were afraid to take the jump to something harder/more rewarding.
I don't do drugs but that seemed like a fitting analogy.
I don't do drugs but that seemed like a fitting analogy.
Hillmachine
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You rule Flah. I gave there debut a spin last night just out of boredom and i was suprised to find that it stills holds its own in my collection, too bad about the rest though. Peachy fucking stinks, Follow the Leader has its moments, Issues was wank, Untouchables is my least favourite album of all time and lets not talk about Take a look in the mirror. They have a new one out right?... ugh, who cares.
Hang on, i should pick a band which i can defend right?. How about Neurosis or The Deftones
Flah
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Neurosis: One of the best thing that American metal has had to offer in the past twenty years. I never found the records preceding Souls at Zero that interesting. I'm sure if I listened to those first, they'd carry a bit more weight but as of right now, I see them as stepping stones and not much more. Of the band's two later periods, arty sludge (I don't know how else to explain it) and trippy art rock with a droning quality, I find the second to be fascinating. A Sun that Never Sets and The Eye of Every Storm are landmark albums that should be issued to people when they decide to open their minds to music with a progressive lean. I enjoy Time of Grace (especially with its Tribes of Neurot side added into the mix) and Through Silver in Blood too, but not quite as much. I think the restraint that they would later exhibit is one of their true strengths. Steve Von Till's vocals are classic and while his lyrics are really vague and at times a little dopey, they do fit the mood and atmosphere of the music like a glove. One of my favorites.
Deftones: As time goes by, I find Adrenaline to be more and more unlistenable. It sounds like a product of the time with light rap touches and hardcore influences. Bored's main riff still sits well, but the rest is so slight in substance and quality that I'm kind of surprised that it sold so well. Of course, this is looking at the album eleven years later. Thank god they didn't stick with that sound. I find Around the Fur and White Pony to be on equal footing, albeit for different reasons. Around the Fur showed the band trying to expand the realms of alt-metal and doing it successfully, moving into killer rock hooks like the one on Be Quiet And Drive which I regard to be their best song. There was still some sloppy moments, the lyrics are rather dull and the band seems to be held down by trying to remain heavy volume wise when they could so easily push past that and create music that was still heavy, but with atmosphere. I think that's why I grew to like White Pony so much; they really went after the atmosphere and became one of the few rock groups with progressive elements that garnered appeal from the mainstream (Tool and Dredg being the others). Still, there are dead spots on White Pony too, Elite being one and the duet with Maynard being the other. Their self-titled album was lazy, songs built around only one riff, similar to the construction of Metallica's Black Album and almost with the same fallout. I think there are still some strong moments there though mostly because the band was still toying with infusing rock ready for radio with a healthy dose of atmosphere. I find the band's obsession with synth-pop to be annoying when they write songs that specifically glorify those elements but its effect on the rest of their music is great. It drove them to be catchy, progressive, and heavy when they wanted to be; a rare combo. One of the brightest stars in mainstream rock for good reason.
Deftones: As time goes by, I find Adrenaline to be more and more unlistenable. It sounds like a product of the time with light rap touches and hardcore influences. Bored's main riff still sits well, but the rest is so slight in substance and quality that I'm kind of surprised that it sold so well. Of course, this is looking at the album eleven years later. Thank god they didn't stick with that sound. I find Around the Fur and White Pony to be on equal footing, albeit for different reasons. Around the Fur showed the band trying to expand the realms of alt-metal and doing it successfully, moving into killer rock hooks like the one on Be Quiet And Drive which I regard to be their best song. There was still some sloppy moments, the lyrics are rather dull and the band seems to be held down by trying to remain heavy volume wise when they could so easily push past that and create music that was still heavy, but with atmosphere. I think that's why I grew to like White Pony so much; they really went after the atmosphere and became one of the few rock groups with progressive elements that garnered appeal from the mainstream (Tool and Dredg being the others). Still, there are dead spots on White Pony too, Elite being one and the duet with Maynard being the other. Their self-titled album was lazy, songs built around only one riff, similar to the construction of Metallica's Black Album and almost with the same fallout. I think there are still some strong moments there though mostly because the band was still toying with infusing rock ready for radio with a healthy dose of atmosphere. I find the band's obsession with synth-pop to be annoying when they write songs that specifically glorify those elements but its effect on the rest of their music is great. It drove them to be catchy, progressive, and heavy when they wanted to be; a rare combo. One of the brightest stars in mainstream rock for good reason.
Hillmachine
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Man, you're good. Do you review for magazines and shit?
Its good to see someone else feels the same about Neurosis. In my opinion, the last two albums are definately the most accessible and anyone who wants to check them out should start with 'A sun that never sets', but i would say Times of Grace is the best album. Its just the heaviest album i have ever heard... not sound heavy, but just emotionally heavy. I never really felt it until i listened to it in the dark with headphones on. 'The Eye of Every Storm' as you said really is breathtaking (when im in the right mood), but for me just lacks a bit of fire. The restraint is just a little too obvious and in some parts you really want them to let loose, but it never really happens. Can't wait for the next one... ive heard its this year!!
Your Deftones comments are spot on too. Although unlike yourself i still really appreciate Adrenaline. I just really dig the raw chugging riffs, i dunno maybe its just a nostalgia thing.
Its good to see someone else feels the same about Neurosis. In my opinion, the last two albums are definately the most accessible and anyone who wants to check them out should start with 'A sun that never sets', but i would say Times of Grace is the best album. Its just the heaviest album i have ever heard... not sound heavy, but just emotionally heavy. I never really felt it until i listened to it in the dark with headphones on. 'The Eye of Every Storm' as you said really is breathtaking (when im in the right mood), but for me just lacks a bit of fire. The restraint is just a little too obvious and in some parts you really want them to let loose, but it never really happens. Can't wait for the next one... ive heard its this year!!
Your Deftones comments are spot on too. Although unlike yourself i still really appreciate Adrenaline. I just really dig the raw chugging riffs, i dunno maybe its just a nostalgia thing.
Hillmachine
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Who was the best grunge band?
Come on guys lets keep him busy...
Come on guys lets keep him busy...
Hillmachine
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CamelToe said:
i said best, not most obscure!
Flah
New member
Going to make these shorter, I have to be somewhere.
Blindside: I never listened to too much Blindside, I thought their early stuff was okay though, s/t and A Thought Crushed My Mind in particular. The jump to more commercial avenues was okay but kind of got lost in the stream of likeminded bands doing very similar stuff. Stronger than most alt-metal bands that got on the radio right around the turn to the '00s, but never interested me enough to check out a full album after they left Solid State/Tooth and Nail.
Dark Tranquillity: At least one melodeath band is sticking with their sound. Last year's Character was considered a comeback, I don't know, I didn't think Damage Done was terrible or anything. The Gallery is just one of those albums that you need to own if you like melodeath, goes hand in hand with Slaughter of the Soul and The Jester Race. Honestly, I always found the vocals to be a bit montonous and the songwriting rehashed some areas (read: got tedious) but that's kind of par for the course when it comes to the genre. Back in the '90s I would've said this band was tops on the second teir, now, sadly, they're the best by default for not changing.
Demon Hunter: A lot of people say this band sounds like Slipknot. I don't hear it. Mixing metal with hooks qualifies you as a Slipknot cover band? Okay, I don't really think so. I listen to some of s/t a few years back and thought it was okay but never was interested enough to revisit the band. Their names are kind of ridiculous; Sgt. Seprent, Utah Biggs, etc.
Testament: Classic thrash. They were hit and miss at points in their career, but I like most of what I've heard and I don't often find myself drawn to thrash. It seems unfair that Metallica and Megadeth get the recongintion when Testament is now only revered in the underground circles. Anyway, Alex Skolnick was a great guitarist and Chuck Billy was your classic thrash vocalist. Even later in their career, they still found that spark, The Gathering is a fine fine albums (featuring Steve DiGiorgio!). I don't listen to much thrash but I listen to Testament. That should say something.
Auf der Mar: I...never listened to her. I thought her presence in Hole made that band better than they should've been but her time with Smashing Pumpkins came at a time when I was losing faith in their songwriting abilities. She fronted a Black Sabbath tribute band, Hand of Doom, so that earns her a little cred. Her solo album came out right when I decided that I'd never listen to the radio again so I just kind of missed the boat so to speak.
The Pixies: I like Frank Black a lot. His early solo work is fantastic (try listening to Headache or well, any of Teenage of the Year and not have it be rattling around your skull for the next few days). As for The Pixies, I find them to be hit or miss. About 70% of Surfer Rosa works for me but shit like Tony's Theme feels like a throwaway. Doolittle on the other hand works nearly on the whole. Classic stuff. I can't say too much about the rest of their disco, Bossanova is good, Trompe le Monde works well as a repersentation of where Frank Black would head. I never devoted as much time as I probably should've to the band because there's just too much music out there to listen to. Ah, if I could only stop time. I share a dream with Cher, scary.
The Lords of the New Church: Never listened but I've heard of them. Beyond Wire, Buzzcocks, Gang of Four and hearing The Clash at nearly every party I went to for awhile (it was really weird), I never took a big interest in early punk favoring hardcore. I haven't listened to much Dead Boys or the Damned either. I'll admit, I'm too young for this stuff, haha.
Best Grunge Band: I'm going to cheat and lump in a band that preceded that whole movement but were a huge influence. Melvins.
Blindside: I never listened to too much Blindside, I thought their early stuff was okay though, s/t and A Thought Crushed My Mind in particular. The jump to more commercial avenues was okay but kind of got lost in the stream of likeminded bands doing very similar stuff. Stronger than most alt-metal bands that got on the radio right around the turn to the '00s, but never interested me enough to check out a full album after they left Solid State/Tooth and Nail.
Dark Tranquillity: At least one melodeath band is sticking with their sound. Last year's Character was considered a comeback, I don't know, I didn't think Damage Done was terrible or anything. The Gallery is just one of those albums that you need to own if you like melodeath, goes hand in hand with Slaughter of the Soul and The Jester Race. Honestly, I always found the vocals to be a bit montonous and the songwriting rehashed some areas (read: got tedious) but that's kind of par for the course when it comes to the genre. Back in the '90s I would've said this band was tops on the second teir, now, sadly, they're the best by default for not changing.
Demon Hunter: A lot of people say this band sounds like Slipknot. I don't hear it. Mixing metal with hooks qualifies you as a Slipknot cover band? Okay, I don't really think so. I listen to some of s/t a few years back and thought it was okay but never was interested enough to revisit the band. Their names are kind of ridiculous; Sgt. Seprent, Utah Biggs, etc.
Testament: Classic thrash. They were hit and miss at points in their career, but I like most of what I've heard and I don't often find myself drawn to thrash. It seems unfair that Metallica and Megadeth get the recongintion when Testament is now only revered in the underground circles. Anyway, Alex Skolnick was a great guitarist and Chuck Billy was your classic thrash vocalist. Even later in their career, they still found that spark, The Gathering is a fine fine albums (featuring Steve DiGiorgio!). I don't listen to much thrash but I listen to Testament. That should say something.
Auf der Mar: I...never listened to her. I thought her presence in Hole made that band better than they should've been but her time with Smashing Pumpkins came at a time when I was losing faith in their songwriting abilities. She fronted a Black Sabbath tribute band, Hand of Doom, so that earns her a little cred. Her solo album came out right when I decided that I'd never listen to the radio again so I just kind of missed the boat so to speak.
The Pixies: I like Frank Black a lot. His early solo work is fantastic (try listening to Headache or well, any of Teenage of the Year and not have it be rattling around your skull for the next few days). As for The Pixies, I find them to be hit or miss. About 70% of Surfer Rosa works for me but shit like Tony's Theme feels like a throwaway. Doolittle on the other hand works nearly on the whole. Classic stuff. I can't say too much about the rest of their disco, Bossanova is good, Trompe le Monde works well as a repersentation of where Frank Black would head. I never devoted as much time as I probably should've to the band because there's just too much music out there to listen to. Ah, if I could only stop time. I share a dream with Cher, scary.
The Lords of the New Church: Never listened but I've heard of them. Beyond Wire, Buzzcocks, Gang of Four and hearing The Clash at nearly every party I went to for awhile (it was really weird), I never took a big interest in early punk favoring hardcore. I haven't listened to much Dead Boys or the Damned either. I'll admit, I'm too young for this stuff, haha.
Best Grunge Band: I'm going to cheat and lump in a band that preceded that whole movement but were a huge influence. Melvins.
SoreArms
New member
Muhoney is not obscure but definatley not mainstream. I assumed someone asking about "grunge" would know about them. Maybe you wanted to hear "Pearl Jam" or "Nirvana" or "Temple of the Dog" (or this that one too obscure too?)Hillmachine said:
Flah, that stuff is beyond my years too, LOL, but I'm a punk devotee, specially a lot of that early stuff. Although LOTNC is more on the death rock side but I guess early death rock was more punk than goth.
I think I'm one of the few that happens to enjoy Surfer Rosa alsmot as a whole, but I agree that there are a few throw away songs and Doolittle was the Pixies best album, period.
Hillmachine
New member
CamelToe said:
I was just playing sir, lets not get into name-checking bands shall we. i appreciate Mudhoney. But yes when i said grunge, i was referring to the 'big four', i should have been more specific. So yes Flah you cheated
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