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Ethical Marketing?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Elite_Fry
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Elite_Fry

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I'm hopeless with these types of things. But anyway here is what i have done so far, it would be most appreciated if you could read through it and let me know if it sounds like im on the right track and if the english is good. I'm not worried about pronounciation and spelling atm because im doing it in notepad and word can pick those up later. I know a lot of it is incomplete and im still working on it. But how does it read so far?


I need to discuss ethical issues in marketing a product or serivce, factors involved as to whether a proposal is ethical/unethical using examples etc.


(i want to use a quote as my intro)



There are many people from around the world who wonder how marketers can do what they do without feeling sick to the their stomachs. How can someone promote and encourge a product or service which ultimately has the power to harm an individual? It is this reason why the marketing profession has always been accused of self-interest. It doesnt seem to matter what is being sold by the marketer as long as the financial outcome is there.

I think an important factor you need to make in a decision on whether or not to market a product is that you need to believe in what your selling. If you can convince yourself that the customer is going to be better off for having bought it and that your selling yields positive benefits than you are upholding your ethical values and doing something good.

However whether or not the product does yield a positive benefit is not answered easily. Does this mean if the product makes the person feel good, alternately making him better off with it, necessarily make it a "good" product to sell? What about tobacco and fast food companies for example?



Selling cigarettes to someone who is addicited may be making them happy but the physical and health complications have not been taken into consideration. There is documented proof that cigarettes are harmful and can lead to lung cancer.

A lot of people would then feel it is unethical to market tobacco because of the such high health risks and dangers, but is there anyone who doesnt already know the risks of smoking to your health? is there anyone who isnt aware smoking is addictive? Look on any packet of cigarettes and you will find warnings such as "Smoking is addictice", "Smoking causes lung cancer", "Smoking can harm you baby" etc. The marketers of these products don't just sell us these products without educating us, they make us aware of the complications with smoking. So would that then make it okay and ethical?

In an interview with Michel Poirier, Chairman, President & CEO of JTI-Macdonald Corp., one of Canadas largest tobacco selling companies quoted:
"Let me give you the essence of our marketing strategy. First, we do not encourage anyone to smoke. But the fact is that there are more than five million smokers in Canada. Our goal is to win as large a share of that adult market as we can. So, our marketing objective is simply this; if you are an adult and enjoy smoking, we would like you to smoke our brands."



Same goes with the fast food industry. Studies have shown that by the age of 20, 70% of the population have developed some degree of coronary artery disease and one out of every three children have high levels of cholesterol. 80% of America's kids now eat more fat than is recommended by the American Heart Association. Those happy commercials showing actors playing and laughing while munching down a mouth watering golden, deep fried patty with plenty of melted cheese, this may satisfy the taste-buds, but also unfortunately blocks the arties. In the end, someone dies, including 400,000 Americans from heart disease each year.
 
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http://www.userfriendly.org/illiad/wtf.jpg
 
When it comes to products that affect your health, i don't see it as the marketer being unethical. I really think the government needs to get more active on informing the public so they can make informed decisions. This means properly educating our youth in the school system about food and health. Right now this does not happen, and in fact the opposite happens when they allow fast food companies, soft drink companies, etc. to sell their products to children in their very own schools during their developmental years. I feel the government needs to make changes and improvements to health education in this country.



Each company holds their own code of ethics which is a written system of standards for ethical conduct. When your company holds a code of ethics that not all other companies are holding, you have already put yourself at a disadvantage by limiting yourself. If you are happy with the reduced profits and can sleep well at night knowing you did the ethical thing, that is great. But there will be someone else out there who was more cunning who will laugh all the way to the bank.
 
elite fry said:
When it comes to products that affect your health, i don't see it as the marketer being unethical. I really think the government needs to get more active on informing the public so they can make informed decisions. This means properly educating our youth in the school system about food and health. Right now this does not happen, and in fact the opposite happens when they allow fast food companies, soft drink companies, etc. to sell their products to children in their very own schools during their developmental years. I feel the government needs to make changes and improvements to health education in this country.



Each company holds their own code of ethics which is a written system of standards for ethical conduct. When your company holds a code of ethics that not all other companies are holding, you have already put yourself at a disadvantage by limiting yourself. If you are happy with the reduced profits and can sleep well at night knowing you did the ethical thing, that is great. But there will be someone else out there who was more cunning who will laugh all the way to the bank.

wtf.jpg
 
Cocktail sauce. 1/4cup of ketchup, 2tsps of horseradish, half a lemon squeezed. Stir until mixed. Eat with jumbo shrimp and a Lowenbrau Dark pint.
 
Companies have an ethical oblgation to make money the moment they take-on shareholders and/or expose someone else to risk (borrow money).

As far as other moral considerations... In the legal world, there is a concept that since people either directly (via balloting) or indirectly (via voting for representitives) make laws, that the laws reflect morality. Therefore, companies that operate within the law are acting within societies morals.
 
mrplunkey said:
Companies have an ethical oblgation to make money the moment they take-on shareholders and/or expose someone else to risk (borrow money).

As far as other moral considerations... In the legal world, there is a concept that since people either directly (via balloting) or indirectly (via voting for representitives) make laws, that the laws reflect morality. Therefore, companies that operate within the law are acting within societies morals.
At least Thats What They Tell themselves at the funerals.
 
When has trying to sell something ever been ethical.. get real
 
We sell cigarettes to nicottine addicts, alcohols to alcoholics, goods and services to ppl with spending problems

I am a marketer/ advertiser and i am the devils pawn :)
 
CanadianCutie said:
We sell cigarettes to nicottine addicts, alcohols to alcoholics, goods and services to ppl with spending problems

I am a marketer/ advertiser and i am the devils pawn :)
Yeah But The pharmaceutical Companies are on The Up and Up Right?


Bwahahahahahahahhahaha *cough* Bwahahahahahahahahahahhaha
 
CanadianCutie said:
We sell cigarettes to nicottine addicts, alcohols to alcoholics, goods and services to ppl with spending problems

I am a marketer/ advertiser and i am the devils pawn :)
I like the way you think! I was in marketing as well ;-)
 
CanadianCutie said:
We sell cigarettes to nicottine addicts, alcohols to alcoholics, goods and services to ppl with spending problems

I am a marketer/ advertiser and i am the devils pawn :)
This is a bit too much (I really didn't agree with the guy) but it's a funny story anyway.

I used to run marketing for one of the businesses in a Fortune 5 company. The CEO of the business was mentoring me in the ways of marketing, since my background was engineering originally (but I'm reformed now... i'm nerd-free!).

Anyway, and again... this is too much... but here were my unofficial "Goals and Objectives" for the year:

1) Seperate the marketing from the doing (Read: it's ok to promote what you don't have)
2) Play it like you got it (Read: tell everyone the product is already there and good to go)
3) Don't let the facts get in the way of a great pitch.

Strangely enough, he went-on to be the CEO of a very prominent company (many of you would have heard of the company).
 
I'm honest..i work corporate side.. costs us a few bucks to make a product and we mark it up.. well i'm not even gonna tell how mcuh.. but rediculous..

but I know we're number one in most of the world in our field.. and it makes me laugh... because its this way in ym business.. and it's this way in every business..

Right now i'm not selling too ppls addictions, but im sure ppl go into debt buying our pruducts :worried:

mrplunkey said:
I like the way you think! I was in marketing as well ;-)
 
CanadianCutie said:
We sell cigarettes to nicottine addicts, alcohols to alcoholics, goods and services to ppl with spending problems

I am a marketer/ advertiser and i am the devils pawn :)


you don't sell anything - they buy. it's that simple. now we can get into marketing to children, which is a separate issue. but if we are talking about marketing to adults, I have always believed that the onus (sp?) is on the consumer. Now that arguement won't stand up in court, but it makes sense to me. Let's start putting the responsibility and ownership back onto the adult consumer who has free will and the ability to choose.
 
KillahBee said:
you don't sell anything - they buy. it's that simple. now we can get into marketing to children, which is a separate issue. but if we are talking about marketing to adults, I have always believed that the onus (sp?) is on the consumer. Now that arguement won't stand up in court, but it makes sense to me. Let's start putting the responsibility and ownership back onto the adult consumer who has free will and the ability to choose.
I agree But its Not So Cut And Dry man.
 
perfectworld said:
Yeah But The pharmaceutical Companies are on The Up and Up Right?


Bwahahahahahahahhahaha *cough* Bwahahahahahahahahahahhaha

Dude, pharmaceutical companies have saved billions of lives with the medicines they create, how many have you saved? How do you think research and development of new medicines get paid for, government models of bringing new meds to the people are dismal failures in comparison.
 
In college i learn what you are currently doing is called rationalization.. which in lamens terms means.. "BULLSHITTING till u believe it"



KillahBee said:
you don't sell anything - they buy. it's that simple. now we can get into marketing to children, which is a separate issue. but if we are talking about marketing to adults, I have always believed that the onus (sp?) is on the consumer. Now that arguement won't stand up in court, but it makes sense to me. Let's start putting the responsibility and ownership back onto the adult consumer who has free will and the ability to choose.
 
BrothaBill said:
Dude, pharmaceutical companies have saved billions of lives with the medicines they create, how many have you saved? How do you think research and development of new medicines get paid for, government models of bringing new meds to the people are dismal failures in comparison.


their products have also destroyed many lives and helped to create addictions.

Think of it sensibly - why the fuck do PRESCRIPTION DRUGS need to be advertised???????
 
We sell images we sell ideas, we sell dreams..

we put ideas into consumers ideas that alot of this in attainable..

some of it is.. some of it is not..
 
BrothaBill said:
Dude, pharmaceutical companies have saved billions of lives with the medicines they create, how many have you saved? How do you think research and development of new medicines get paid for, government models of bringing new meds to the people are dismal failures in comparison.
They dont Save Lives they Prolong them so you can By more "Medicine".

the "Cures" you think you mean were Created a Long time ago.

Before They Worried about Marketing.

Name a "Cure" BB.

Name One.

And Ive Helped Lots Of people.Gosh Dont Make It Like That.
 
CanadianCutie said:
We sell images we sell ideas, we sell dreams..

we put ideas into consumers ideas that alot of this in attainable..

some of it is.. some of it is not..

are you selling to retarded 4-year-olds? if not, then it is 100% on the consumer to decide if they want to buy or not. I understand the power of marketing and the goals, but I never hear anyone blaming the consumer.
 
perfectworld said:
I agree But its Not So Cut And Dry man.
An educated consumer really is the only solution though. The concept of "sales puffery" has been around since the first caveman pitched the "EZ Lite" torch and "Fat-Free Wooly Mammoth meat" to his unsuspecting comrades.
 
CanadianCutie said:
In college i learn what you are currently doing is called rationalization.. which in lamens terms means.. "BULLSHITTING till u believe it"
well you need to go back to Psych 101. Maybe you need to grow the fuck up just like everyone else who blames the big bad IMC companies for "making me smoke". If an ad can make you do something, then you need to die along with every other weak, weak person on earth so we can all have a chance at surviving this world. Cause we're all fucked with the weak running around making decisions.
 
mrplunkey said:
An educated consumer really is the only solution though. The concept of "sales puffery" has been around since the first caveman pitched the "EZ Lite" torch and "Fat-Free Wooly Mammoth meat" to his unsuspecting comrades.
Indeed.

Just Like democracy btw. :)

But An educated consumer isnt Allway Good for the Bottom Line.
 
If products were just sold as is.. and werent built up then i would totally blame the consumer.. but often an image, a life style etc are sold with products .. so i find it hard to hold consumers resposible

KillahBee said:
are you selling to retarded 4-year-olds? if not, then it is 100% on the consumer to decide if they want to buy or not. I understand the power of marketing and the goals, but I never hear anyone blaming the consumer.
 
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CanadianCutie said:
Id products were just sold as is.. and werent built up then i would totally blame the consumer.. but often an image, a life style etc are sold with products .. so i find it hard to hold consumers resposible
Good Point CC.

Hence the Existance of your Job right?

Im not flaming you A Niggas Got to eat.
 
perfectworld said:
They dont Save Lives they Prolong them so you can By more "Medicine".

the "Cures" you think you mean were Created a Long time ago.

Before They Worried about Marketing.

Name a "Cure" BB.

Name One.

And Ive Helped Lots Of people.Gosh Dont Make It Like That.
The "cure" model in medicine has been largely exhausted. The bulk of neato, gee-whiz, silver-bullet cures have been developed. That doesn't mean we'll still have more cures coming, but all the easy stuff has been done -- that's what made it easy.

It's true the pharmaceutical industry has moved from the "cure" model to the "treat" model, and a lot of it was financially motivated. The other opportunity though is that the "treat" model opens-up the number of diseases you can address by at least 10 fold... probably more like 100 fold.

But fear not and buckle-up buttercup! The industry is shifting yet again... The next phase will be "personalized medicine" (which isn't truly personallized, but it is much more targeted based on your specific gene sequences). It will bring-on additional cures, bucketloads of additional treatments and will be freaky expensive. Oh, and the drug approval process will completely crumble under this new model due to the sparcity of data for each and every drug. It's not hard finding 55+ year olds with a history of heart disease to test your new asthma drug on... but wait till you have to find 55+ year olds with a history of heart disease *and* a particular gene sequence to base your clinical trials upon. The medical statisticians are freaking out already!

Oh, and get ready for some crazy-expensive, crazy-effective drugs!
 
perfectworld said:
Good Point CC.

Hence the Existance of your Job right?

Im not flaming you A Niggas Got to eat.

it's a terrible point. her point is based on this assumption - "people have no control over their own thoughts, feelings and actions. All a marketing co. has to do is package a product nicely, give it a good brand image and tag line, and the poor defenseless human beings on earth have NO CHOICE but to buy it."

granted, a lot of people on earth are like this now, and it looks like CC is too. But fuck, it doesn't make it alright. If you believe that human beings have free will, then her arguement holds now water.
 
Hmm im not.. but i know my job.. exisits because i build up these.. dreams etc..

I don't think a new productor service will improve my life.. but know that if i help creat the uillusuon for enough ppl.. ym job is secure for that much longer...

I don't buy into it as much.. because i am a part of creating it. does that make sense

KillahBee said:
it's a terrible point. her point is based on this assumption - "people have no control over their own thoughts, feelings and actions. All a marketing co. has to do is package a product nicely, give it a good brand image and tag line, and the poor defenseless human beings on earth have NO CHOICE but to buy it."

granted, a lot of people on earth are like this now, and it looks like CC is too. But fuck, it doesn't make it alright. If you believe that human beings have free will, then her arguement holds now water.
 
elite fry said:
yeh but is what i have written any good?

lol - gotta go to the gym now but I will read it when I get back and let you know what I think if you are interested. What class is this for, what year are you, and does your teacher respond better to unoriginal thought that agrees with the masses and general teachings in most US colleges, or does he/she truly appreciate "different" reasoning, as long as it makes sense?
 
KillahBee said:
it's a terrible point. her point is based on this assumption - "people have no control over their own thoughts, feelings and actions. All a marketing co. has to do is package a product nicely, give it a good brand image and tag line, and the poor defenseless human beings on earth have NO CHOICE but to buy it."

granted, a lot of people on earth are like this now, and it looks like CC is too. But fuck, it doesn't make it alright. If you believe that human beings have free will, then her arguement holds now water.
We are Extraordinary Animals For Sure.

But we are Still Subject to Conditioning Bro.
 
CanadianCutie said:
Hmm im not.. but i know my job.. exisits because i build up these.. dreams etc..

I don't think a new productor service will improve my life.. but know that if i help creat the uillusuon for enough ppl.. ym job is secure for that much longer...

I don't buy into it as much.. because i am a part of creating it. does that make sense
yes it does make sense. does what I am saying make sense? All I see is people putting the blame on marketing companies - They made me buy it! - to shuck responsibility. Now I have been in some form of marketing for a while and realize that execs try to sell these products in the manners you speak of. To me, there is nothing wrong with that, because the consumer has the choice to buy or not buy. It's that simple.

And if all this worked that well and was so easy, then why are we seeing a huge shift from traditional advertising to non-traditional advertising (experiential marketing) for many top global brands?
 
KillahBee said:
lol - gotta go to the gym now but I will read it when I get back and let you know what I think if you are interested. What class is this for, what year are you, and does your teacher respond better to unoriginal thought that agrees with the masses and general teachings in most US colleges, or does he/she truly appreciate "different" reasoning, as long as it makes sense?


that would be fantastic

im doing my first year in a business marketing diploma

the class is - business ethics and law

she used to be a lawyer so who knows
 
CanadianCutie said:
I don't buy into it as much.. because i am a part of creating it. does that make sense
You have to be that way CC... Rule #1 in Marketing is "Never believe your own bullshit". If you start believing your own spin, you can spin yourself into believing even the most terrible ideas are viable. Be your own worst critic, but then reward yourself from time-to-time as well :)
 
perfectworld said:
We are Extraordinary Animals For Sure.

But we are Still Subject to Conditioning Bro.

I understand, and I would be lying if I said I had never bought a completely useless or evne harmful product for some unknown reason that definitely had something to do with the marketing of that prodcut. BUT I WOULD NEVER BLAME THE MARKETING COMPANY FOR MAKING ME BUY IT. It was 100% my choice.
 
KillahBee said:
I understand, and I would be lying if I said I had never bought a completely useless or evne harmful product for some unknown reason that definitely had something to do with the marketing of that prodcut. BUT I WOULD NEVER BLAME THE MARKETING COMPANY FOR MAKING ME BUY IT. It was 100% my choice.
I Understand what You Mean too.

I wouldnt "Blame" anyone Either.

But That Doesnt not Make It Thier Fault.

I believe That This attitude is a Part Of A Social Conditioning as Well.
 
perfectworld said:
Its Good But its Short.

Does that Matter to The Teacher?


its nowhere near finished.. i need to get to 1500 words

its just what i had and wanted to make sure it sounded okay so far

not due till 10 days but i wanna make it good
 
Markets are changing.. there is more competeting.. we could discuss this for hours and the reasoning and the causes are endless.. and you know this :)

Like you i have work in field for a while.. close to 6 yrs.

Started my career in promotion moved into media planning and buying, moved into production, then marketing and now i do marketing and promotion for a global technology company.

So I'm pretty familar with advertising and the way marketing works...

I'm not saying I like or agree with the way things are done.. but it's the truth.. Man i gotta go find my ditzy cap.. I don't wanna come off too smart for a sunday morning.. I might break m cover.. :verygood:


KillahBee said:
yes it does make sense. does what I am saying make sense? All I see is people putting the blame on marketing companies - They made me buy it! - to shuck responsibility. Now I have been in some form of marketing for a while and realize that execs try to sell these products in the manners you speak of. To me, there is nothing wrong with that, because the consumer has the choice to buy or not buy. It's that simple.

And if all this worked that well and was so easy, then why are we seeing a huge shift from traditional advertising to non-traditional advertising (experiential marketing) for many top global brands?
 
elite fry said:
its nowhere near finished.. i need to get to 1500 words

its just what i had and wanted to make sure it sounded okay so far

not due till 10 days but i wanna make it good
Sure its Good Bro.

I think This Thread Will Give you Some More Good Stuff to Think About As Well.

:)
 
CanadianCutie said:
Markets are changing.. there is more competeting.. we could discuss this for hours and the reasoning and the causes are endless.. and you know this :)

Like you i have work in field for a while.. close to 6 yrs.

Started my career in promotion moved into media planning and buying, moved into production, then marketing and now i do marketing and promotion for a global technology company.

So I'm pretty familar with advertising and the way marketing works...

I'm not saying I like or agree with the way things are done.. but it's the truth.. Man i gotta go find my ditzy cap.. I don't wanna come off too smart for a sunday morning.. I might break m cover.. :verygood:

Dont Do IT.
 
LoL, has anyone actually read the entire piece of Elite Fry's attempt on a piece of writing?
It seemed that he tried really hard too..


I haven't read it sorry.

Although, I must say that the concept of ethical marketing can kiss my ass.
Body Shop is a strong supporter of "against animal testing" or cruelty into creating its goods, but is it really necessary for sandals to be tagged with "no animal testing was involved"?
 
Nothing to do with psy or growing up.. diffeent experiences..

I didn't say i buy into what is being sold.. I said i help creat illusions that make other do it.. and i am aware of this fact...

Advertisers have power.. if they didnt.. then there would be no point in advertsing...

Why does this FACT mean i should grow up and i'm unclear why you appear to be getting sao defensive...

Hun it's not you against me.. I'm stating an opinion that i can happily back up..

KillahBee said:
well you need to go back to Psych 101. Maybe you need to grow the fuck up just like everyone else who blames the big bad IMC companies for "making me smoke". If an ad can make you do something, then you need to die along with every other weak, weak person on earth so we can all have a chance at surviving this world. Cause we're all fucked with the weak running around making decisions.
 
Hmmm see i think what you percieve to be as choice is where we have the disagreement..

Choice.. how did u make that CHOICE?

KillahBee said:
I understand, and I would be lying if I said I had never bought a completely useless or evne harmful product for some unknown reason that definitely had something to do with the marketing of that prodcut. BUT I WOULD NEVER BLAME THE MARKETING COMPANY FOR MAKING ME BUY IT. It was 100% my choice.
 
I will if he wants me too :worried:


Growth&Courage said:
LoL, has anyone actually read the entire piece of Elite Fry's attempt on a piece of writing?
It seemed that he tried really hard too..


I haven't read it sorry.

Although, I must say that the concept of ethical marketing can kiss my ass.
Body Shop is a strong supporter of "against animal testing" or cruelty into creating its goods, but is it really necessary for sandals to be tagged with "no animal testing was involved"?
 
perfectworld said:
They dont Save Lives they Prolong them so you can By more "Medicine".

the "Cures" you think you mean were Created a Long time ago.

Before They Worried about Marketing.

Name a "Cure" BB.

Name One.

And Ive Helped Lots Of people.Gosh Dont Make It Like That.

Small pox, cancer treatments, bacterial infections. Dude the list of cures is long...
And of course, none of us out getting out of this alive, but you should be able to understand the use of 'saved' in my statement so just expand your vocabulary a bit.
I know several people in the pharmaceutical industry and they are good and decent and hardworking individuals that are striving to help people have a better longer life.
You shouldnt attribute evil motives to everyone. Love thy brother PW
 
BrothaBill said:
Small pox, cancer treatments, bacterial infections. Dude the list of cures is long...
And of course, none of us out getting out of this alive, but you should be able to understand the use of 'saved' in my statement so just expand your vocabulary a bit.
I know several people in the pharmaceutical industry and they are good and decent and hardworking individuals that are striving to help people have a better longer life.
You shouldnt attribute evil motives to everyone. Love thy brother PW
PW is still pissed at them because the first injection didn't fix-up his clap right away. ;)
 
BrothaBill said:
Small pox, cancer treatments, bacterial infections. Dude the list of cures is long...
And of course, none of us out getting out of this alive, but you should be able to understand the use of 'saved' in my statement so just expand your vocabulary a bit.
I know several people in the pharmaceutical industry and they are good and decent and hardworking individuals that are striving to help people have a better longer life.
You shouldnt attribute evil motives to everyone. Love thy brother PW
that List Of "Cures" is OLD ....not long.

We are Talking about Marketing anyway.

whens the last Time you Saw a Small Pox Vaccine Commercial?
 
their products have also destroyed many lives and helped to create addictions.

Think of it sensibly - why the fuck do PRESCRIPTION DRUGS need to be advertised???????
Actually if you read history opium, cocaine and most other drugs that are used for addiction far precede drug companies so I fail to see your logic or your point.

I have thought about and talked to many physicians about it. Most do not like it one bit, but also the continued depersonalized care that people are receiving that more aware of the different drugs available to them means they can be a partner in their care.
I dont see why you would be arguing that becoming aware of different meds is a bad thing. Consumers are more saavy today than ever before. Doctors sometimes get into a rut with an outdated medication. If a patient comes in after seeing a commercial on a new med with better efficacy then that is an advantage to the patient and their health. And the prescribing Doc can just say "no" to the patient who wants any medication.
 
Drug companies advertise on television because not everyone is a member of the technologically elite like PW thus they can't research medications on the Internet.

A drug is a product, why wouldn't you advertise it?
 
CanadianCutie said:
If products were just sold as is.. and werent built up then i would totally blame the consumer.. but often an image, a life style etc are sold with products .. so i find it hard to hold consumers resposible


Exactly is a feeling that they are buying. There is no purpose of jewelry for instance yet people spends loads of money on it.
Its a simple concept that some of you fail to grasp.
Marketing is simple: "Fulfilling the needs and wants of the consumer, at a profit"
What is so hard about that one cant grasp. The only other alternative is communism and that only looks good on paper.
 
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