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lartinos
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What do you guys think, help or hinder?
Mythicalbeing
New member
I read somewhere that dhea wasn't it it was touted to be...I'll do some digging and find it....
Mythicalbeing
New member
DHEA may increase the effects of barbiturates, a class of medications often used to treat sleep disorders. You should not take DHEA with these medications unless under the supervision of your healthcare practitioner.
An animal study indicates that DHEA may increase the effectiveness of cancer treatments with cisplatin; further studies are needed to confirm these effects in people. Talk to your healthcare provider before adding DHEA to your medication regimen if you are currently being treated with cisplatin.
DHEA may also increase the effects of prednisolone, a corticosteroid medication used to treat inflammation and other disorders, when used in combination with this medication. Check with your healthcare practitioner before taking DHEA supplements if you are on prednisolone.
What Is DHEA?
Dehydroepiandrosterone, or DHEA, is a steroid hormone, a chemical cousin of testosterone and estrogen. It is made from cholesterol by the adrenal glands, which sit atop each kidney. For the first few years of life, the adrenals make very little DHEA. Around age six or seven, they begin churning it out. Production peaks in the mid-20s, when DHEA is the most abundant hormone in circulation. From one's early '30s on, there's a steady decline in DHEA production, so the average 75-year-old has only 20% of the DHEA in circulation that he or she had 50 years earlier. At all ages, men tend to have higher DHEA levels than women.
By definition, hormones are chemical messengers made in a gland or tissue that start, stop, or otherwise orchestrate activity in some other issue. That makes DHEA a hormone in name only, since no one knows exactly what it does in the body. For years it was thought to be a kind of chemical trash left over from making other hormones. Today, "we still haven't been able to identify any mechanism of action," says Dr. Casson.
In fact, about the only thing that researchers can agree on is that DHEA is easily converted into other hormones, especially estrogen and testosterone.
The Food and Drug Administration isn't sure what to do with DHEA supplements. Ten years ago the agency told companies to stop selling DHEA, which was marketed at the time for weight loss, and classified it as an unapproved new drug, obtainable only by prescription. Then in 1994, DHEA was reclassified as a dietary supplement, allowing sales over the counter.
The Evidence
Much of DHEA's reputation as a wonder hormone comes from experiments in which mice or rats were fed daily doses. Such studies have shown that DHEA can prevent or delay the onset of cancer, "hardening" of the arteries, lethal viral infections, lowered immunity, obesity, and diabetes. But what works in rodents doesn't necessarily work in humans. That may be especially true in this case, because rats and mice produce only about 1/10,000 the DHEA we do.
An early human study that pointed to possible benefits for DHEA came from Dr. Barrett-Connor's group. They measured DHEA levels in blood samples taken from almost 2,000 men and women between 1972 and 1974 and looked at how many died from heart disease. In 1986, they reported that men with high DHEA levels were far less likely to have died of heart disease, while women with high DHEA levels were at greater risk. A more detailed analysis published late last year, however, showed that men with above-average DHEA levels back in the early 1970s were only 15% less likely to have died of heart disease, while there was no association between DHEA levels and heart disease in women.
The longest and perhaps most carefully conducted work in humans comes from Dr. Yen and his associates. In their latest study, published last year in a special issue of the Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences devoted to DHEA and aging, eight men and eight women aged 50 to 65 took either 100 milligrams of DHEA or an identical placebo pill each night for three months. For three months after that, they took the opposite pill.
Within two weeks of starting DHEA, circulating levels of the hormone were a bit higher than normally found in young adults. Lean body mass increased slightly in both sexes, as did muscle strength, which also improved with the placebo. Fat body mass decreased in men but increased a bit in women. There was also a rise in some chemical markers that suggested improvement in immune function, though the number of colds and other illnesses was not measured.
An earlier study from Dr. Yen's group showed that three months of daily 50-milligram doses of DHEA significantly improved the sense of "well-being," it did not improve sex drive, as advertisements for DHEA often claim..
Another study in which volunteers took DHEA suggests that this hormone may help treat the autoimmune disease lupus. Trials looking at DHEA's ability to boost the immune system and maintain mental function in older adults are in progress.
Experiments on a few dozen people over six months hardly constitute proof that a treatment works. "What we really need at this point are some long-term clinical trials to identify clear benefits and risks," says Dr. Nestler.
One reason why such trials are crucial is that DHEA has side effects, some of which may be irreversible. Since DHEA is converted into testosterone, some women who take it grow body or facial hair and, if they are under age 50 or so, can stop menstruating. DHEA has also been shown to decrease levels of HDL ("good") cholesterol in women, and could increase the risk of heart disease, the leading killer of older women. "We have no idea what DHEA might do to the risk of breast cancer," says Dr. Nestler.
In men, the increased levels of testosterone seen with daily DHEA pills could stimulate the growth of a tiny prostate tumor that would otherwise have remained dormant. Excess testosterone could also cause the prostate to enlarge, making urination difficult.
The Bottom Line
Much of the popular and scientific interest in DHEA stems from our culture's emphasis on youth. If levels of this hormone decline with age, the thinking goes, we could avoid the health problems that accompany aging -- or even extend our lifespan -- by keeping DHEA levels high. Many people are already taking DHEA just in case this turns out to be true. That wouldn't be a problem if this substance were as safe as vitamin C. But as a potent steroid hormone, DHEA has the potential for far-reaching side effects throughout the body.
The rush to take DHEA is a curious paradox, especially when compared with the slow, almost grudging acceptance of hormone replacement therapy for older women. After menopause, hormone supplements that boost dwindling levels of estrogen help prevent osteoporosis and may protect against heart disease. There are also some known or suspected risks with estrogen replacement, such as a possible increase in the risk of breast cancer. Despite mounting evidence that the benefits substantially outweigh the risks, most women in the US choose not to start hormone replacement therapy.
With DHEA and aging, there are no proven benefits and some potentially serious risks. Yet people are flocking to use this virtually unregulated substance, which troubles HealthNews associate editor Arthur Feinberg, MD.
"The potential for irreversible side effects is real," he says. "So given that there's no convincing evidence for any benefit of DHEA, I feel strongly that people should not take it."
An animal study indicates that DHEA may increase the effectiveness of cancer treatments with cisplatin; further studies are needed to confirm these effects in people. Talk to your healthcare provider before adding DHEA to your medication regimen if you are currently being treated with cisplatin.
DHEA may also increase the effects of prednisolone, a corticosteroid medication used to treat inflammation and other disorders, when used in combination with this medication. Check with your healthcare practitioner before taking DHEA supplements if you are on prednisolone.
What Is DHEA?
Dehydroepiandrosterone, or DHEA, is a steroid hormone, a chemical cousin of testosterone and estrogen. It is made from cholesterol by the adrenal glands, which sit atop each kidney. For the first few years of life, the adrenals make very little DHEA. Around age six or seven, they begin churning it out. Production peaks in the mid-20s, when DHEA is the most abundant hormone in circulation. From one's early '30s on, there's a steady decline in DHEA production, so the average 75-year-old has only 20% of the DHEA in circulation that he or she had 50 years earlier. At all ages, men tend to have higher DHEA levels than women.
By definition, hormones are chemical messengers made in a gland or tissue that start, stop, or otherwise orchestrate activity in some other issue. That makes DHEA a hormone in name only, since no one knows exactly what it does in the body. For years it was thought to be a kind of chemical trash left over from making other hormones. Today, "we still haven't been able to identify any mechanism of action," says Dr. Casson.
In fact, about the only thing that researchers can agree on is that DHEA is easily converted into other hormones, especially estrogen and testosterone.
The Food and Drug Administration isn't sure what to do with DHEA supplements. Ten years ago the agency told companies to stop selling DHEA, which was marketed at the time for weight loss, and classified it as an unapproved new drug, obtainable only by prescription. Then in 1994, DHEA was reclassified as a dietary supplement, allowing sales over the counter.
The Evidence
Much of DHEA's reputation as a wonder hormone comes from experiments in which mice or rats were fed daily doses. Such studies have shown that DHEA can prevent or delay the onset of cancer, "hardening" of the arteries, lethal viral infections, lowered immunity, obesity, and diabetes. But what works in rodents doesn't necessarily work in humans. That may be especially true in this case, because rats and mice produce only about 1/10,000 the DHEA we do.
An early human study that pointed to possible benefits for DHEA came from Dr. Barrett-Connor's group. They measured DHEA levels in blood samples taken from almost 2,000 men and women between 1972 and 1974 and looked at how many died from heart disease. In 1986, they reported that men with high DHEA levels were far less likely to have died of heart disease, while women with high DHEA levels were at greater risk. A more detailed analysis published late last year, however, showed that men with above-average DHEA levels back in the early 1970s were only 15% less likely to have died of heart disease, while there was no association between DHEA levels and heart disease in women.
The longest and perhaps most carefully conducted work in humans comes from Dr. Yen and his associates. In their latest study, published last year in a special issue of the Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences devoted to DHEA and aging, eight men and eight women aged 50 to 65 took either 100 milligrams of DHEA or an identical placebo pill each night for three months. For three months after that, they took the opposite pill.
Within two weeks of starting DHEA, circulating levels of the hormone were a bit higher than normally found in young adults. Lean body mass increased slightly in both sexes, as did muscle strength, which also improved with the placebo. Fat body mass decreased in men but increased a bit in women. There was also a rise in some chemical markers that suggested improvement in immune function, though the number of colds and other illnesses was not measured.
An earlier study from Dr. Yen's group showed that three months of daily 50-milligram doses of DHEA significantly improved the sense of "well-being," it did not improve sex drive, as advertisements for DHEA often claim..
Another study in which volunteers took DHEA suggests that this hormone may help treat the autoimmune disease lupus. Trials looking at DHEA's ability to boost the immune system and maintain mental function in older adults are in progress.
Experiments on a few dozen people over six months hardly constitute proof that a treatment works. "What we really need at this point are some long-term clinical trials to identify clear benefits and risks," says Dr. Nestler.
One reason why such trials are crucial is that DHEA has side effects, some of which may be irreversible. Since DHEA is converted into testosterone, some women who take it grow body or facial hair and, if they are under age 50 or so, can stop menstruating. DHEA has also been shown to decrease levels of HDL ("good") cholesterol in women, and could increase the risk of heart disease, the leading killer of older women. "We have no idea what DHEA might do to the risk of breast cancer," says Dr. Nestler.
In men, the increased levels of testosterone seen with daily DHEA pills could stimulate the growth of a tiny prostate tumor that would otherwise have remained dormant. Excess testosterone could also cause the prostate to enlarge, making urination difficult.
The Bottom Line
Much of the popular and scientific interest in DHEA stems from our culture's emphasis on youth. If levels of this hormone decline with age, the thinking goes, we could avoid the health problems that accompany aging -- or even extend our lifespan -- by keeping DHEA levels high. Many people are already taking DHEA just in case this turns out to be true. That wouldn't be a problem if this substance were as safe as vitamin C. But as a potent steroid hormone, DHEA has the potential for far-reaching side effects throughout the body.
The rush to take DHEA is a curious paradox, especially when compared with the slow, almost grudging acceptance of hormone replacement therapy for older women. After menopause, hormone supplements that boost dwindling levels of estrogen help prevent osteoporosis and may protect against heart disease. There are also some known or suspected risks with estrogen replacement, such as a possible increase in the risk of breast cancer. Despite mounting evidence that the benefits substantially outweigh the risks, most women in the US choose not to start hormone replacement therapy.
With DHEA and aging, there are no proven benefits and some potentially serious risks. Yet people are flocking to use this virtually unregulated substance, which troubles HealthNews associate editor Arthur Feinberg, MD.
"The potential for irreversible side effects is real," he says. "So given that there's no convincing evidence for any benefit of DHEA, I feel strongly that people should not take it."
buckwheat1
New member
In men, DHEA is does not really convert to testosterone and if it does it will be in very small amounts. So adding it to PCT should not effect recovery in a negative way. In Women, it can boost testosterone and can cause increase in libido, facial hair, etc. for some.
DHEA itself does not have any feedback loop. Meaning if you take DHEA, your body does not stop making DHEA itself .
One of the things that happens as we age is the DHEA/Cortisol ratio changes. DHEA declines and Cortisol increases. Many believe that this has health implications. So by adding DHEA the ratio is restored to younger levels.
I think that adding DHEA and also 7-Keto might be helpful and I don't think it can hurt. They are both relatively cheap substances.
During PCT, you could try: 100mg DHEA/day and 200mg 7-keto/day.
7-Keto cannot convert into testosterone.
DHEA itself does not have any feedback loop. Meaning if you take DHEA, your body does not stop making DHEA itself .
One of the things that happens as we age is the DHEA/Cortisol ratio changes. DHEA declines and Cortisol increases. Many believe that this has health implications. So by adding DHEA the ratio is restored to younger levels.
I think that adding DHEA and also 7-Keto might be helpful and I don't think it can hurt. They are both relatively cheap substances.
During PCT, you could try: 100mg DHEA/day and 200mg 7-keto/day.
7-Keto cannot convert into testosterone.
Mythicalbeing
New member
It's a fifty fifty as the article reads. Depending on the supplements doseage, BUT there reamins alot of testing to be done as to the actual effects.
L
lartinos
Guest
Great info guys thanks
buckwheat1
New member
Triple J said:
This is true. But conversion either way is usual low. Nothing compared to the estrogen that gets created when you inject test. Since he mentioned PCT, he probably is already using an aromotase inhibitor or something like Nolva/Clomid to block estrogens effects.
I have read scientific studies showing that DHEA and Cortisol/Cortisones have counter balancing interactions ie elevated dhea incurs a lower cortisol level. So DHEA can be beneficial to a post cycle elevated cortisol/cortisone environment.
Ill see what i can find in my archives.
Ill see what i can find in my archives.
L
lartinos
Guest
I take it after coming off tren for that very reason, and i think it works. i run tren at the beginning of cycles BTW.
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