The GH "Gut" Myth Unravaled.

Article follows..

In recent years, a number of writers have observed that increasing numbers of world-class bodybuilders appear at contests with low body fat, etched abdominal muscles and protruding guts. We have named this phenomena "Protruding Gut Syndrome" or "PGS" for short. Most notable among its victims is none other than Mr. Olympia himself, Dorian Yates. One writer suggested that this was a side effect of Steroid use. Another, influential editor, states flatly that it is caused by the use of hGH or GH releasers. There is no research to support either explanation. Frankly, there is no proof that this protruding gut phenomena exists at all or that if it does it is anything new. Our eyes tell us that there is a problem that is manifest in some physique stars. The question is when did it first appear and is it restricted to Steroid and/or GH users. It seems to me that in the 1950's, before Steroids, hGH or GH releasers, there were competitors that exhibited the same "problem". Moreover, the problem is not by any means limited to "ergogenic" drug users. An observant individual will notice it in thin individuals of every stripe who have never trained with weights or even exercised to any significant degree. If I'm correct, and I believe I am, the cause is failure to develop the set of muscles that are tasked with the role of holding the internal organs within the abdominopelvic cavity. This may be exacerbated somewhat in obese or formerly obese individuals by intra-visceral fat deposits, organ enlargement and prolapse of the abdominopelvic visceral sheath. Nevertheless, in most cases it is a lack of muscle development. These muscles have no significant visibility externally. In other words, they are not "show" muscles. Because they don't show directly, many never train them. Moreover, some who do train them don't realize that they are doing so or the benefit they derive from doing so. As an example, in a training course sold by Frank Zane many years ago, titled "How to Develop Championship Legs and a Small Waistline" he describes a technique called the "Stomach Vacuum". This is the kind of "exercise" that helps develop the muscles of which I speak. Arnold describes the same technique in his Encyclopedia of Modern Bodybuilding. It may not mean anything but neither Arnold nor Zane showed any evidence of protruding gut. By the way, before I go any further, it is worth pointing out that the most notable of these muscles are the internal obliques and the transverse abdominis but the Iliacus, Soleus and Intercostals are also involved. These muscles get a fair amount of stimulation from sit-ups but practically none from crunches. Over the past twenty years, the crunch has replaced the sit-up as the exercise of choice for developing the abdominals (technically rectus abdominis). This allows for another explanation of the increasing prevalence, if such exists, of PGS.

The lack of specific exercise for the gut retaining muscles is not the whole explanation for the phenomena. If it were, everyone who doesn't exercise would manifest the problem. As we can see by observing the public at large, this is not the case. However prevalent the problem, it is not universal among those who do not exercise. This suggests that while lack of the proper exercise may contribute to the problem, it is not the cause. Normally, the visceral sheath combined with the natural tonus of the retaining muscles is sufficient to maintain the organs within the Abdominopelvic cavity. Something must stretch the visceral wall and overcome the natural tonus of the retaining muscles, enter the big dinner, the TV and the soft couch. After eating the stomach and intestines are full of food and are, therefore, heavier and occupy more space then when empty. If the meal is particularly large they may require more space then can be provided in the un-distended space they have available to them. If one sits and the knees bend beyond 90 degrees, the space is further restricted. If the shoulders roll forward, as in relaxation, still further reduction of space is imposed by the pressure of the diaphragm in its downward excursion. Leaning forward, as some drivers do and as some chairs encourage one to do, allows gravity to force the viscera forward, placing increased pressure on the visceral wall. Watching television with the chin held on the hands also places the body in this position of increased pressure on the visceral wall. For the body builder, or weight lifter, guzzling water or workout drinks and then squatting creates incredible inter-visceral force. In fact, almost any movement performed in a forward bent position and any movement performed wearing a lifting belt also increases the pressure to astronomical levels. In other words, there are a host of behaviors, some of them unique to weight trainers others not, that create the distention that precedes PGS. Add in the reduced natural tonus common to a more or less sedentary life style and we have all the explanation required.

Also have a thread on exercises to reduce the "GH gut"...if you wanna call it that....let me know if anyone is interested.

bump for liquidanny. Would love to see the exercises.

Here are the exercises they suggest....weird buddhist stuff but you can get the idea of what motion you want to achive..and just use a machine in the gym

Uddiyana Bandha

To practice Uddiyana Bandha, empty the lungs with a quick, forcible exhalation. As soon as the lungs are empty, the diaphragm rises naturally into the thoracic cavity. When there is no interference from the diaphragm, draw the intestines and other organs toward the back as far as you can. The stomach rests near the back of the body, in the thoracic cavity. The technique can be practiced in either a sitting or standing position but standing is better. While standing, place your hands firmly on the thighs, keep the legs apart, and bend your trunk slightly forward. Don't attempt to hold the abdomen in this position for very long at first. With practice, you'll be able to keep the abdomen in this position as long as you can hold your breath outside your lungs. This technique can be repeated five to eight times with brief intervals to catch your breath.

For beginners, it takes some time to master Uddiyana Bandha. It takes effort and time for the abdominal muscles to strengthen and be brought under control. Once you're able to perform the Uddiyana Bandha contraction well, it is possible to practice this next, more advanced, exercise. Once after have mastered Uddiyana Bandha sufficiently, you can go on to practice Nauli.




Nauli Kriya

While standing, perform the Uddiyana contraction. You will be bent forward with each hand resting on its respective thigh. Once in this position, allow the center of the abdomen to release by contracting the left and right sides of the abdomen, the internal obliques. This will bring the central abdominal muscles into a vertical line. This first position is called Madhyana Nauli (central contraction).

After mastering the central Nauli, the next step is to get control over the left and right muscles of the abdomen separately. These are known as Vama and Dakshina Nauli (left and right contraction). The technique is essentially the same as the central one, except that you apply more pressure on the thighs with the hands. If the left side is to be contracted, the left hand presses on the thigh, the trunk bending slightly forward and to the left. The opposite applies to the right side.

All these processes of Uddiyana, central, left and right Nauli churn or rotate the abdominal muscles. This churning is done in a moderately quick succession, performing the central Nauli then the left, then the right Nauli all while maintaining Uddiyana Bandha. All the above processes combined bring wonderful control over the abdominal muscles, excellent tone and defeat PGS.

The difficulty you have learning these exercises depends on your abdominal muscles. Before mastering Uddiyana and Nauli, one has to lose excess fat by other means. In some cases, when the abdominal muscles are very tight, whether there is fat or no, may be difficult to practice until you loosen the muscles. People who have loose muscles can control them in a shorter period.

I actually have this problem, a weak tranversus abdominus.

My physiotherapist even mentionned it and showed me some exercises.

At 12% BF, I have a 34-35 inch waist.

These exercises have helped a lot and hooefully with more time It will get smaller.

BUMP!!!!! FOR liquidanny

This post is GRRREAT! Really informative and I am one of these guys with a case of PGS.

Actually as with everything in BB genetics plays a little part too. I am saving this info. Everyone who reads this should send you some positive Karma!!

I am really a more recent user of Gh...but I know two individuals first had at my gym that have been long time users with no GH gut problems. They are the ones who alerted me that its more a genetics issue than anything else. I think that most people combine GH with insulin...that being forcefeeding usually follows.......

I am going to try to find more data...i think this is a topic way underdiscussed. People just assume you get GH when you use and are scared to do so or try to scare others away without any empirical data.

I would suspect the large volumous meals/shakes might add to the weak muscles compounding the problem.

Rugger

More Training for the Transverse Abdominus

How does one train or activate these muscles?

Players and coaches need to look beyond the traditional exercise such as crunches, sit-ups and leg lifts. Players should regularly perform exercises that activate the muscles in the stabilising function. These do not entail a lot of movement and only require sub-maximal, but continuous contractions.

Learn to pull the lower part of the stomach, below the navel, “up and in” to activate the transversus abdominus (TA) muscle. Squeeze the muscles that are used to stop the flow of urine (Kegel exercise) to help to activate the pelvic floor. Make a point of keeping your stomach “up and in”, that is contracting TA, during training in the gym or on the field. Also practice contracting TA during your daily activities such as driving and standing in queues. The more you practice the contraction, the more stable your core will become.

Identify the Transversus Abdominus (TA) muscle
Lie on your back. Bend your knees till they are at 90° and place your feet on the floor. Place your hands on your abdomen just medial to the anterior superior iliac spine (ASIS), this is medial (towards the middle of your stomach) from your hip bones, and push your fingers firmly into your tummy. Cough or laugh. The muscle that you feel pushing against your fingers is TA. Keeping this muscle tight and strong is the basis of all core stability training.

TA should be contracted during all movements. We learn to train it consciously, but eventually it should become a subconscious contraction. It is important to breath normally while initially learning to contract your TA, in order for it to become a subconscious action. The more you practice consciously contracting TA, the sooner it will start contracting subconsciously.

Tighten your TA muscle and hold for 5 X 5 breaths in and out. Concentrate on breathing: On an exhalation, contract your TA and continue to breath. It is important not to hold your breath.

Core stability has become a regular part of training of all the TOP rugby sides in the world – the benefits are enormous and injuries are minimised after successful stability training. Good luck and get started!!


TRAINING TIP: CORE STABILITY

In order to start a core stability programme it is important to understand the principles of stabilising. Being able to identify and train the tranversus abdominus is very important.

Pelvic stabilisers: Bridging


1. Lie supine (on your back) on a comfortable surface.
2. Bend your knees to 90° and keep your feet flat on the floor.
3. Tighten your Transverse Abdominus (TA) and hold the contraction.
4. Keep your TA stable and lift your buttocks off the ground. If you cannot hold your pelvis area stable and level, it is a sign of poor stability.
5. Hold this position with your pelvis in a neutral position and only your shoulders and your feet are touching the ground.
6. Hold this for about 10 seconds. You can repeat this exercise 10 times.
7. It is important to breathe normally throughout this exercise.
8. Each time you finish a repetition, relax and then re-stabilise the pelvis.
9. As you progresses, you can extend the time you hold each repetition.

The article is an interesting read but, confuses GH gut with beer gut.

Excellent post liquidanny. Thank you.

Another way is to do some private pilates sessions. I know, most people will laugh at this, but the whole idea of it is to strengthen these areas. I did a series after an injury to the hips to try and strengthen the area. Very effective.

The 'vacuum' exercise described above that Arnold, Zane (and others) advocate...anyone have real world feedback on these exercises? I have never heard anyone talk much about them.

Experience feedback on these exercises, please!

Rugger

I don't buy it.......it's common knowledge that steroids and more specifically GH, triggers internal organ growth. Why is that you never see any old school BB"s with the kinds of guts we see in today's BB's. In fact, the old school guys had stomachs that were almost sick looking in the way they protruded inward. Look at pics of Arnold, his stomach basically dived straight into his body right at the edges of his ribcage.

umm, no flame, but..

"it's common knowledge that steroids and more specifically GH, triggers internal organ growth...his stomach basically dived straight into his body right at the edges of his ribcage."

big, are u saing arnold didn't use, or that he isn't old school, i'm confused. Otherwise, you do agree, because you just supported his ab routine. Steroids cause a gut, arnold used steroids, but arnold does not have a gut; therefore, these exercises that he alks of are effective... Eitherway you are supporting this claim. Just something to think about. No flame, just confused at first.

bump good post, you got karma from me.

Sweet Post my friend!!

I found that when I first gained my weight eating not stop like a slob and got severely bloated on some occassions and ever since then my stomach never was as flat and seemed just to hang out sometimes.

Awesome Read!

Peace
DrZ

DrZaius, has that bloat gone away....do u think its permanent or with the above exercises it can be fixed?

Stomach Vacuum Exercise (Zane)

Stomach Vacuums

Finally, and most importantly, perform stomach vacuums during the active rest period. The stomach vacuum (as perfected by Arnold and Frank Zane) is one of the best exercises you can perform to shrink your waistline in a very short period of time. I can generally knock several inches off my waistline just by performing vacuums for a three-week period. Although the vacuum takes some practice to master, it’s extremely effective in helping you gain great control over your abdominals and giving your waistline a paper-thin appearance.


Perform a vacuum by exhaling all the air in your lungs, sticking your chest out, and trying to touch your belly button to your backbone (don’t worry, you will never accomplish this). Hold for 10 to 20 seconds, relax, and repeat. The simplest way to perform vacuums when starting out is from a kneeling position on all fours. As you begin to master the vacuum in this position, you can also perform it in an upright kneeling, seated, or standing position. Like anything else, the more you practice the easier it becomes and the more control you will have over flexing your abdominals. Eventually, you will be able to do these anywhere, from driving in your car to standing in line at the grocery store.

After completing the circuit and active rest period, “DO IT AGAIN, SOLDIER... NOW!”—and upon completing the second cycle, you guessed it—“ONE MORE TIME!” After finishing the third cycle—“AT EASE!” Relax, go home, slam a performance-nutrition shake, and enjoy the burning sensation you should be feeling in your abs.

Your abs will continue to be sore for a few days after completing Ab Boot Camp. In fact, they will still be sore by the time you are ready to repeat the routine two days later. That’s OK though, because the abdominals recover quickly (even before the soreness is gone). Perform this routine at least three times per week after your cardio sessions.

If you don’t feel the above workout is giving you the results you want, you can also add some supplemental ab training. For instance, before your weight workouts do a few sets of some hanging leg raises and/or knee-ups from a pull-up bar. These are great lower ab exercises and they loosen you up nicely for your workout. They will also help stretch the abdominals (and probably remind you how just how sore they are). Thankfully, this stretching does help diminish the pain a bit quicker.

Do not forget to do as many stomach vacuums as often as you remember. You can never do too many of these when trying to peak your abs. Remember, you can do these inconspicuously just about anywhere—at work, standing in line, wherever, and no one will have a clue. You will develop tremendous control over flexing your abdominals. And speaking of flexing, like any muscle, the more you flex your abdominals, the more defined they will become. You can do this by exhaling all the air in your lungs and tightening your midsection as hard as you can.

bump -- ive been donig the stomach vacuum for 3 days now and seen very noticeable results...i presume this is because i have a low bodyfat to begin with however, just weak TA's

bump for the gut...

Excellent post my friend,
Just one thing to add: Guys, throw away your weight belts unless you lift REALLY heavy. You know what I'm talking about; those guys that put on a belt at the beggining of a workout and they only take it off when they're all done... All the belt does is compensate for your weak transversal abs in creating that intra-abdominal pressure meant to stabilize the lombar portion of your spine.

bumping because I start GH next week

I'm with BigPhysBastard-----To answer your question about old school bbuilders, they didn't even come close to the dosages of GH and gear that the late 80s(when some were getting "GH" gut to now where every pro has one"and i do mean everyone"---some just worse then others-----I know a guy that became a pro as a middleweight(years ago) Even when he was a pro, he was a pretty light pro and he never got more then 25 pounds out of comp. shape----meaning he never really did any "force feeding" ---relatively moderate cals all year long and he did have a GH Gut---------People can believe what they want but there is no doubt that GH has everything to do with the GH gut-----This stuff is just wishfull thinking. Just my opinion and almost everyone elses that either competes or has competed or is going to compete
Next I'll bet someone will say that there is no evidence that GH makes bones grow----

Wombat said:

I'm with BigPhysBastard-----To answer your question about old school bbuilders, they didn't even come close to the dosages of GH and gear that the late 80s(when some were getting "GH" gut to now where every pro has one"and i do mean everyone"---some just worse then others-----I know a guy that became a pro as a middleweight(years ago) Even when he was a pro, he was a pretty light pro and he never got more then 25 pounds out of comp. shape----meaning he never really did any "force feeding" ---relatively moderate cals all year long and he did have a GH Gut---------People can believe what they want but there is no doubt that GH has everything to do with the GH gut-----This stuff is just wishfull thinking. Just my opinion and almost everyone elses that either competes or has competed or is going to compete
Next I'll bet someone will say that there is no evidence that GH makes bones grow----

Click to expand...

I agree. I don't claim to know the cause, but to say the BBer's of old had it like the BBer's of today is flat out wrong.

genarr3 said:

I agree. I don't claim to know the cause, but to say the BBer's of old had it like the BBer's of today is flat out wrong.

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I didn't say the BB of old has it like they do today---I said GH gut became known in the late 80s--I also said not everyone had it like every pro does now-----The dosages are probably 4 fold to that of the 80s and probably close to 10 fold of the Arnold age.....I don't know the cause either but I just think its wishfull thinking to say GH has nothing to do with the pretruding Gut----peace

Wombat said:

I didn't say the BB of old has it like they do today---I said GH gut became known in the late 80s--I also said not everyone had it like every pro does now-----The dosages are probably 4 fold to that of the 80s and probably close to 10 fold of the Arnold age.....I don't know the cause either but I just think its wishfull thinking to say GH has nothing to do with the pretruding Gut----peace

Click to expand...

Maybe I didn't present myself correctly, I agreed with you. I was disagreeing with the original author.

I'm wondering if anyone who tried these exercises for a few months have seen good results?

Lewd

Androgens and GH do cause bloating...often in the belly.
However if there is actual organ growth is debatable.

great post BUT

i disagree. In the seventies there where not many "roid guts" (or whatever.)
We must consider this: if it was caused by doing some exercices and not because of roid and GH abuse then all Ronnie Coleman has to do is change his ab routine and be the reigning king for another decade.
So this leaves "roid abuse combined with GH and Slin".
In my opinion the Ronnie gut-look has nothing to do with exercices. Everyone knows that GH enlarges your stomac, liver, etc...There you have it your GH-gut.

Liquidanny

Thanks for an excellent post, I just printed and saved it,

I have never taken gh, but have this problem, and understand more about the real cause from your post, I may buy both Frank’s and Arnold’s books,

I have the strongest ab muscles in my gym, but with my shirt on I look like a short fat guy, at 51 that’s not the reason I go to the gym and constantly do cycles,

It also blows your psyche and makes you simply say-hey I’m not a body builder, should consider a different sport, tom stay lean.

When the real problem for some of us in not bf but the muscles you identified in your post.

Thanks again

GH makes everything grow, even cancer. I don't remember seeing pictures of guts like that of today's pros on BBers from the seventies or eighties. Obviously there are varying degrees of it, but damn I doubt anybody on this board (even if you think you do) has a gut like Ronnie Coleman, Dennis James, or Greg Kovacs. You can't tell me it's not GH (gear related).