Blood Tests -- What you need -- What we need to help you.

[Seth Roberts]

I see a lot of people posting their blood test results here -- which is great and I and others are more than willing to help interpret the results. I also see posts asking which tests people should get. I therefore feel it is necessary to offer my advice as to which tests a person should get and when and which information the people here need to help out.
Firstly, it is important to get blood work done BEFORE you start your cycle. I see a lot of people posting their post-cycle blood work but very few have pre-cycle numbers. How can you know if your numbers are elevated or suppressed if you don't know what they were before you started. Optimally, you should get tested before you start, at the end of your cycle and a month or two after your cycle is over. If you can afford it, you could do a mid cycle test and also get more post cycle work done (say every month after), but, pre, post and follow up are really the minimum I would do.

Here's what you need:
CBC
Chem-20
Complete Thyroid screen (T-3 uptake, Total T4, Free T4, total T3, Free T3, Free T4 index, TSH, TBG)
Prolactin
Total test
Free test
LH, FSH

These are some additional tests that would be great to have if you can afford them.
Estrogen level (preferably estradiol, estrone and estriol but some idea of estrogen is better than none)
ACTH
Cortisol

The absolute bare minimum I would suggest is:
Chem-20
total test
free test

In any case, when you tell us your results we need to know what you are/were taking, your age, your pre-cycle results. It is important to give the units (like ng/ml) as it differs depending on country, lab etc... Hopefully this will put an end to posts saying "My test level is 291 -- What does it mean?" -- It means nothing unless we have units, free and total test levels and put it in context of what your baseline levels were, what you took on your cycle etc...
Hope that helps,
Seth

 

[Seth Roberts]

Of course

Of course, Any information offered is for informational purposes only and not meant to be substituted for that of a licensed medical practitioner no matter how inept they may be.

 

[guards]

good info bro

 

[McBane]

If you dont mind me asking what is included in the Chem-20 and CBC

 

[Rich_d]

Sorry to be stupid but I'm new to this. I thought when you guys talked about blood tests, you had to go to your doctors or something. Are there kits or something that you can get or where can you go to get tests done. Don't really want to go to the doc as he's a family friend, rather he not know I'm juicin, at least while I feel healthy anyway.

 

[DaMan]

DrJMW prescribes bloodtests for you for a small fee, just ask him.

 

[DrJMW]

Updated Info

I like the following blood tests run. Once before, while clean, and once during a cycle to see the reaction of the body. I like to just run the testosterone levels once post-cycle to see the recovery.

Hormone

1. Cortisol, Total (367)
2. DHEA Sulfate (402)
3. IGF-1 (839)
4. IGFBP-3 (34458)
5. T3, Free (34429)
6. T4, Free (866-78)
7. TSH (899-75)
8. Testosterone, Total, Free and Weakly Bound (30741)
9. Hemoglobin A1C (496-39)
10. Fasting Insulin (561)

Cardiovascular

11. CBC (6399-20)
12. Comprehensive Metabolic Panel (10231-92)
13. Lipid Panel (7600-4)

Other

14. GGT (482-31) Important Liver Value not included in Comp Metabolic Panel
15. PSA (5363-64)

I have written about the importance of blood testing many times, and I am glad that seth Roberts brought this important topic up again. The BB community will not gain respect until each member regularly gets blood testing.

 

[Fonz]

This is definately one of the most informative posts in some time.

A lot of people just shrug blood tests off.

You shouldn't do this.

Blood tests are important and should always be included.

Fonz

 

[pennypacker]

when you ask your doctor for these tests, don't you need to give him a reason? I don't want to have AS use on my medical record.

 

[jhphd]

when you ask your doctor for these tests, don't you need to give him a reason? I don't want to have AS use on my medical record.

Yes, is there a reason you could tell your doc you need these tests done?

 

[Lestat]

Thanks to reading Dr. JMW's posts I got my blood tests done.

I have not used AAS, however I would like to know where I am now, so that In the future I have a frame of reference should things change. It can't hurt, you'll thank yourself in a year or two to have something to look back on and compare to.

 

[newpump]

for those of us not in the medical field, and completely CLUELESS about this whole blood test thing.. can someone answer a few questions for me?

Where do I get a blood test done? I've asked my doctor before, but I understand that if you ask too many times for a blood test, you run the risk of being denied medial insurance. Is there a better place to get a blood test done? Is there an online/mail order service? How many times per year can you get a blood test done (assuming the answer is my doc needs to do it?) What should I ask the doc to insure that I get "the right test" and "don't generate too much suspicion"?

Sorry if I'm so ignorant - this sounds like an important part of being safe with AAS, and I htink this info could benefit may people on the board .

 

[Seth Roberts]

reasons

Your doctor works for you. If he will not order tests that you request then find a new doctor -- the only reason you should need is "I want them done". I have never heard of anyone being denied medical coverage for getting blood tests done too often -- but someone more in tune with insurance companies might have more info.
Here are the tests in the chem-20 -- also, these tests should be done after an overnight fast

albumin
alkaline phosphatase
ALT (SGPT)
AST (SGOT)
BUN
calcium - serum
serum chloride
CO2
creatinine
direct bilirubin
gamma-GT
glucose test
LDH
phosphorus - serum
potassium test
serum sodium
total bilirubin
total cholesterol
total protein
uric acid

CBC:
The number of red blood cells (RBCs)
The number of white blood cells (WBCs)
The total amount of hemoglobin in the blood
The fraction of the blood composed of red blood cells (hematocrit)
The mean corpuscular volume (MCV) -- the size of the red blood cells
CBC also includes information about the red blood cells that is calculated from the other measurements:

MCH (mean corpuscular hemoglobin)
MCHC (mean corpuscular hemoglobin concentration)
The platelet count is also usually included in the CBC.

 

[easy]

I have a thread going right now about my levels. If you've never had blood work done I can strongly sugest you get to your doc for a physical. Becaus e I went in I now know I have less natural test than a 3 yr old girl. Since I'm only 28 and have never used AAS, I probably would have never known except for the fact that I can look at doughnuts and get fat and my nipples look better than my wifes.

 

[DrJMW]

Re: reasons

Your doctor works for you. If he will not order tests that you request then find a new doctor -- the only reason you should need is "I want them done". I have never heard of anyone being denied medical coverage for getting blood tests done too often -- but someone more in tune with insurance companies might have more info.

Morally, I agree with this statement. Unfortunately, many docs won't order tests without a "medical reason." Technically, Quest and insurance companies require medical reasons for each test. We docs write ICD codes (diagnostic codes) on the Requisition Forms we give the patient to take to the Lab. Many insurance companies to not cover "non-routine" lab tests--like Testosterone levels, IGF and IGFBP levels,etc. That is their right. They also have the right to restrict how many times a year they will cover repetitive testing. Each insurance company is different. An insurance company that doesn't cover testing is no excuse for not getting the testing done.

You really only need three batteries of testing--before you start, during, and recovery..then periodic checks every year or every other year. Someday, docs will routine check test levels and the other "nonroutine" tests.

 

[Seth Roberts]

Thanks Doc

Thanks for the input doc. I have never had problems with getting blood tests from my doc or my insurance company but then again, I usually only stick with the following:
CBC
Chem-20
Complete Thyroid screen (T-3 uptake, Total T4, Free T4, total T3, Free T3, Free T4 index, TSH, TBG)
Prolactin
Total test
Free test
LH, FSH

These are pretty routine tests and my doc has never raised an eyebrow when I've asked for them. The fact that docs need to put down a diagnostic code is not a problem for docs that want to work with you. Also, I don't go to a lab for tests -- my docs office draws the blood and submits them to lab for tests -- perhaps this is also a difference.

 

[DrJMW]

As many of you know, I will authorize the tests I have listed. I have an account with Quest Diagnostics--which is the largest Lab in the USA and they have outlets everywhere. They also have a website www.questdiagnostics.com. I will send you the Requisition form, receive and interpret the results, and email you the results along with commentary. Of course, I need all of the info that Seth Roberts has mentioned at the top of this thread--I need to know if you are pre-cycle, "in cycle," or post-cycle recovery and I need to know what meds you are/were taking. You can email me for more details.

Guys, consider the money spent an investment. Don't make excuses because your insurance won't pay. It is your health we are taking about. The full battery of testing could run $1,000.00, but remember, you only have to do the full battery two or three times and then just check T levels periodically. It is up to you.

 

[mvmaxx]

I've had blood tests run by DrJMW as well. Very solid bro and very helpful.

 

[PatBateman]

best post I've seen in a while

 

[KILLER2001]

Agreed, this is a excellent thread. Answered 99% of my questions.

 

[Tigrones]

THANK YOU. THANK YOU. THANK YOU.

 

[DrJMW]

If you want to find out if your insurance will cover the testing, you will need ICD codes (diagnostic codes) when you call. these codes are: ICD Codes: 253.2; 244.9; 257.2; 285.9

These codes express the "need" for the testing.

 

[time4akshun]

Gyno is always medical reason to get them done. Light or heavy. Worked for me. And yeah, jsut say you smoked alot of pot as a kid and want to make sure your nuts are okay. Sex drive is low. Yadda yadda.

Time

 

[apbt549]

when you go to the doctor what test should you ask for ? and if they ask for what reason you want these test what do you say b/c i want them?

 

[hayabusa976]

very good info.im a newbie and didnt realise til i read this thread just how important the blood testing was.i really appreciate the info you guys put in here.i figured i could just jump into a cycle and be done.i had no idea there were so many factors to consider before starting a cycle.im glad i had the common sense to research everything before starting,thanks

 

[msam76]

Just curious, would a female need the same blood workup?

 

[fitnessfreaky]

I think for anyone concerned about their health should get tested regulary for all the body functions. Testosterone levels are one of those things that are important. At the same time you should consider liver and other organ functions as well. I'm not sure what the difference in price is between testing for testosterone levels and testing for everything, but if they are the same or the insurance company is footing the bill why not get everything analyzed?

Complete Blood work Special Plus Iron & TIBC Price: $ 95.00
Complete Metabolic Panel(14)(kidney, heart and Liver function) Lipld panel, Thyroid panel with TSH, CBC with Differential/ platelets count PLUS Iron and TIBC (total Iron Binding Capacity)

 

[oldrottie]

Learning is forever ....

This is one very interesting thread.

I am a newbie, this is my first post.

Thank you.

Lou