Un-scientific thoughts on gyno and estro problems

[BigPapaPump]

Forgive me all mighty masters for not being able to post links with pages of research concerning this topic......guess you'll have to get over it.

On to the subject at hand. Mind you I give this opinion based on my many years of experience, not from book reading. It seems to me that a bunch of people spend as much time trying to supress estrogen as they do trying to up the testosterone. This makes me believe that since your body spends so much time with low estro that the increase amounts that are associated with the intake of gear, leads the body to over react with that estro. A great example of this would be a typical cycle, complete with all the latest rage in anti-estros. Most of the time the anit's are stopped only a few days after they cycle. Your body has no clue how to handle the estro that the long acting test has generated, so you end up with gyno.

I got on this subject because, many years ago, before we all knew so much, no one ever spent so much time taking novaldex, clomid, proviron....etc. COuld it be that all the old great ones were stupid ? Ever hear of Arnold taking clomid eod throughout his cycle ?

This theory I would think can only apply to men. I've been around for a long time and can't honestly sat that I've ever seen a women with a bad case of gyno. Women do quit well with alot more estro than we have...DUH ! My thinking is that your body can and will adjust given normal patterns.

I'm not saying that everyone should stop taking anti estro's. I think you should allow estro to exist and handle it accordingly. What happens when you build a dam ? Sooner or later the water builds up and breaks through.......then a flood.

BPP

 

[Badkins21]

Interesting, hope some others have opinions on this!

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[Big Bad Booty Daddy]

Very interesting point Big Papa. I'll stick with the anti-estro's though.

 

[Mojo]

I take them because that is what I learned on EF. Are you saying they're not necessary? That would save me some cash for other things. And no I never did hear about Arnold taking Nolvadex or Clomid, but then I thought Rock Hudson was a ladies man too. You're not saying to not take Clomid after a cycle are you?

 

[Geared]

Would like to hear more info on this as well, was planning to do my 2nd cycle with several bulking drugs and the gyno thing scares the hell out of me, but my first cycle of only test. no signs at all of it, or any other sides.

A friend tells me he only takes it if needed and recomends this highly, but have never thought he was the sharpest knife in the drawer either, maybe is smarter than i once expected!

 

[BigPapaPump]

No I'm not saying that anti estros are not needed. For example, I don't know who made the post but there was a cycle which included using proviron 2 wks before hitting the gear, nov and clomid eod. TO me this is way over kill. If you wipe out all the estro in your body with all this preventative crap, sooner or later your it will catch up to you.

I rarely need any clomid or novaldex, A50's require all of the above....but I no longer can tolerate A50 at all. Test in amounts under 1500 mg week usually require nothing. I keep the anti's on hand....just in case. 99.999999999999% of the time, you know when the gyno is creeping in, it doesn't happen over night so as long as you use your brain, you can adjust accordingly.

BPP

 

[xrciseink]

I honestly feel that if you are having gyno problems it's because the doses and the length of the cycle is too high & long. AD-50 is a given....antiestrogens help. However, taking deca, test caused many I know to get gyno, but they all seemed to have the 4-5 month cycle syndrome of higher doses with 2-3 months off. What I consider higher doses may be nothing to most of you. I never had any problems with gyno cycling 8-12 weeks, twice a year, with responsible, well thought out dosing. No more than three different steroids per cycle. Never have I had to use anti-estrogens either. Actually, the only time I ever had some symptoms of gyno was when I was experimenting with 5-Andros in "topical" , "inj" form. If you get gyno, lower the doses on what you are taking. I belive more people piss good gear right into the urinal. The body will only handle so much. More is only better to a degree.

 

[The Ranger]

BPP,
I think alot will have to do with your age, and other factors. I take Nolvadex, and clomid EOD on all my cycles...alternating of course....Simply because I have Diabetes and cannot allow the extra estrogen and associated water weight that comes with it.

Of course, being a great lover of Test, I am forced to take the good with the bad...

My question is: Enanthate is perhaps the longest lasting Test Ester there is, if you were on high dosages(1000mg's per week) and during the third week started to experience extreme gyno.....would it be to late? Would the recepters be activated to the point of no return? I know Armidex would knock this in the ass....but most cannot afford it....Just something to ponder on....Later

 

[MattTheSkywalker]

It is true you may not hear of Arnold taking clomid eod, but weren't the doses of AS they were using considerably lower??

I personally would rather be safe than sorry - although I agree with BPP that there is a fine line between prevention and overkill.....and of course different people have different sensitivities to gyno.

 

[WCP]

Damn good topic...I see your point BPP totally..about it catching up with you...

But what about not so much using say clomid for an anti-aromatase but for keeping natural test levels functioning and avoiding shut down..??...I mean your nuts will come back..but bringing that axis back up to par post cycle is important..and could save some gains..

Ive gotten only mild tenderness thus far as Im sure most of us have..but nothing bad..but considering Im using Aratest next month..I dont trust enanthate enough to push my luck and see if I can do with out clomid till post cycle..interesting though..

WCP



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