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Rather dense AAS question. Please don't flame me.

SteelWeaver

New member
I've read a number of the AAS threads around here, mostly out of idle curiosity, and I'm wondering: do you ever get to keep your gains once you come off cycle? And if you don't, doesn't that mean that once you do one cycle, you're basically bound to keep cycling forever if you want to maintain or increase those gains?

And if you do decide to come off, do you lose your gains but not the sides?
 
So ..... when people consider using AAS, besides asking themselves whether they want to deal with the sides, they should REALLY be asking themselves whether they want to continue cycling for however long they intend to be ... competing? training?

That's quite a long-term proposition. Are there any benefits at all to just doing one cycle?
 
First, I do not think this is a dense question rather a good one.

Steel -- I kept my gains from my primo/winny cycle; the only thing that seemed to fade a bit (for lack of a better word) was the hardness and fullness that I got. Primarily the fullness was bloat from the winny (in 2 weeks I lost about 8 pounds of water after the last winny shot).

Overall I gained 16 pounds -- 8 of which were obviously water. My diet was somewhat calorie restricted -- was not a precontest diet -- but neither a mass eating cycle. I got stronger, leaner and more muscular. I am now 10 weeks off -- and have kept it all -- with now the exception of holiday fattening foods which have caused alittle bit of water retention (!!), I have maintained the gains.

From what I have read over and over, those who do cycles too soon --- ie not allowing their bodies to build naturally to its genetic potential and rush into a cycle, lose alot of their gains. And some aas are more prone to NON-keepable gains over others.
 
spatts said:
I've never lost anything or had a major side stick around. Course, I haven't done much either, and most of what I HAVE tried was in a failed effort to repair my shoulder.

What do you consider to be a "major side?"
 
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sides

Benefits, hummm? Well, yes I think so. If beach festival weather is coming up or something where you just need to look "peak" for whatever reason.

I did winni only for 8 or 10 weeks- I can't remember. A few months afterwards I still had the gains, but they slowly went away. I have none now. No matter how intensely I trained or how heavy I lifted-it went away. I did LOVE the look though. WOW! Big, ripped, vascular but not grossly unfeminine at all. Just a really nice, fit look. People were asking too many questions so I knew it was working. I can see how it could be a very addictive habit. Sides...well let's see...scratchy voice towards the end then sounded like I had a cold all the time. That has -for the most part-cleared up. Lots of acne on my back, gone now. Hair loss, but I had it to lose and it stopped when the cycle ended. No period for 6 months. Of course I consider that a perk!! That's about it I think.
They say (whoever they is, I don't know) that diet had a lot to do with retaining gains but I ate so clean and I don't have any gains remaining. But then maybe I kept the gains longer than if I ate crap.

I have nan prop right now but will use it when I start dieting down probably in about 3 months. Just to try to keep as much muscle as possible.

Anyway, good luck:)
 
Oh, I'm certainly not considering a cycle at all. No no. Not for 5 ... 10 years, if ever. But naturally I AM interested, considering the sport/hobby I'm in. I was asking because I've got the impression from several of the threads I've read that it becomes a bit of a vicious cycle - once you start, you can't stop, because you lose the gains, or need to maintain the gains, or can't increase the gains without bigger doses.

I'm also wondering if the risks are worth the benefits. I mean, if one is a national level competitor, well, I guess you simply don't have any choice, otherwise you'll never get to BE a Nat level competitor, and then you're taking a calculated risk. Or if being lean and hard 24/7/365 is part of your job - like as a fitness model or whatever. But at what point do the risks outweigh the benefits? If you look absolutely killer at the beach but have to shave your face every morning before HITTING the beach, is it worth it?

Sometimes on days when I feel REALLY strong at the gym, when I feel like I can move ANY amount of weight for hours, then I wonder what it must feel like on gear. But the thought of being trapped into cycling forever really scares me.

I read something recently on another board about genetic potential - the guy wrote something like this - how do you know when you've reached your genetic potential? when gains stop for 1 month? 2 months? a year? how can you be sure you've explored EVERY SINGLE option for restarting gains before using gear?

He thought it was an arrogant thing to say - that one had reached one's genetic potential. I mean, if you think about it ... it's quite a thing to SAY. btw - he was saying this as an argument FOR using gear earlier, rather than later (not straight away, but a few years into training). But he made some good points.

Anyway, I don't want to step on any toes here. I'm just very interested.
 
I did not consider for a second that you were stepping on toes -- more like you had a healthy curiousity.

You did say something that struck a cord with me -- not in a bad way. Regarding being in the gym and feeling like you could move any amount of weight all day...while I cannot say that I have done many cycles .... I did not have the "WOW muscle pumps" or "Killer strength increases" that some people experience.

Wherein lies what I wanted to say to you -- if you have the good fortune of having excellent self motivation and self-visualization (which in reading your threads for a while you seem to have it all!), then you may never need aas at all.

If you are a competitor at any level thus far, you have drive, determination and a body that will get you where you need to go -- and since you have been natural thus far and have been experiencing success -- I am thinking you may never need to do a cycle.

There are alot of people out there who do not have that mental drive and determination to get themselves "stoked" at the gym. While I try hard and workout harder and maintain a clean diet for most days of most months, I do not have that spirit that separates the spectators from the warriors....

In other words, the thought, spirit and detemination you projected in your post -- is your AAS so to speak....it has already taken you to the next level. I hope one of these days, I get me somma that!
 
Heh-heh-heh, you sound like me before I did my first cycle...

As far as gains, it's mostly 2 steps forward, 1 step back (in my experience); lately I've been running more powerful anti-estrogens, so gains are more true... I don't know how (or if) this relates to females though (although I have heard of females cutting off of anti-estrogens like liquidex, but board discussion weighed towards it being unsafe).

Although you don't typically retain all the mass, a good portion can be retained, and if nothing else, body composition shifts favorably.

Also, it has been shown that (long-term use of) AS (i.e. reoccuring cycles) activate (dormant) satellite cells to turn into muscle (the tissue of which is permanent).

In general, I think that more anabolic compounds (vs. androgenic) are going to produce less fluctuation in terms of gain/loss (i.e. you'll blow up on androgenic compounds, but will "lose" water weight after the cycle, giving the impression that you're losing gains).
 
Thanks everyone for your comments. And thanks for the compliments newgirl :)

I'm pretty much 100% certain I won't be doing any cycles for a good loooong while, but you never know when the knowledge will come in handy.

At the moment, I can't wait to get to the gym to train, I get a huge thrill out of training, and such fantastic pumps, I can't imagine it could be any better. Damn it feels so good.

I'm not in a hurry. I have my whole life :)
 
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