estrogen blockers and prohormones

[rasta]

I was wondering if any of you ladies have heard of estrogen blockers? I believe they are sold at places like GNC. There is a women at the gym that swears by them (she has the physic of someone using as) and says that those and eca are all that she uses to assist her in achieveing (sp?) her results. I was also wondering if you gals had tried any prohormones and if there was any success. If so what brand did you use and where did you get it?

Thanks
Rasta

 

[MS]

If we're talking about the kinds of estrogen blockers you can get at GNC, then I would not waste my money. They generally have pretty low bioavailability, and are very weak. If you consider how much estrogen is floating around in a normal adult female you will see that taking those OTC blockers is like trying to get high breathing second hand marijuana at an outdoor concert on a windy night.

However, some of the herbal estrogen blockers may offer slight protection from hormonal cancers such as breast if you take them long enough and at a high enough dose.

BTW I know a guy who was taking buckets of herbal estrogen blockers while on a steroid cycle and he still got gyno.

 

[wilson6]

"So if OTC prohormones and blockers are inadequate, is there something else that's legal, so to speak, that's worth trying? Are there foods that decrease estrogen or increase testosterone production?"

Nothing that would actually have a physiological impact. If there were, nobody would use AAS.

W6

 

[MS]

Ummm yeah, what Wilson6 said. Think about it....if there are naturally occuring substances out there that have any significant pharmacological effect you can be sure that they will be regulated by government in the near future. I believe that St John's wort is now headed that way, norephedrine has already gone that way and of course a whole list of other stuff (marijuana, opium etc...).

I'm just wondering when they're gonna put retraints on aspirin and coffee????

There is some evidence that large regular doses of indole-3 carbinol can reduce the chance of developing breast cancer, but this is a LOOOOONG way from getting you ripped. I-3C prolly exerts a low level long term effect on some estrogen sensitive tissues but to get rid of lots of estrogen sensitive fat deposits requires a full-on blitz approach.

 

[rasta]

MS?

What do you mean a "full-on blitz approach"? Some kind of diet/workout combo? Could you describe them?

Thanks
Rasta

 

[MS]

Full on blitz as in tamoxifen, arimidex or other pharmacological estrogen blockers/inhibitors as well as AAS and dieting to very low %bf. In other words drugs if you don't have great genetics.

 

[rasta]

There are a couple of reasons that I am not trying the AAS route, partially money and a great deal having to do with the fact that I can't find them from a trustworthy and quiet source as well as the fact that I would have to hide the use from my husband who is totally against AAS for anyone (males/females). They are just too hard to get. I was hoping to try a supplement combo that would help me achieve my goals, which are...

Currently

5'4"
122lbs
12% bf
ectomorph, hard gainer/naturally lean

Want to be

130lbs
<10% bf
I am fairly striated throughout my body. I need to increase leg size, both calf and quad. I want to get greater definition in my lower back, abs, and glutes.

I run approximately 12-16miles (hill running) a week, in the mornings around 5:30 am

I work out a body part for approximately 45min, my current layout (for the next 6-8weeks)...
chest/front delt/abs
back/rear delt
arms/abs
legs/abs

I work out 5 days a week doing legs twice in a 7 day period.

I eat relatively clean, lots of protein (including two isopure shakes a day) and limited starchy carbs. Because I am trying to gain I have not cut my carbs to low.

Example foods
Oatmeal
yogart
tuna
sirloin
chicken
eggs
raw veggies
brown and wild rice
beans

I try to start my day out with a good source of fiber, eat my starchy carbs by 4:00pm and drink a shake after my workout.

I am not sure how to alter this or what other supplements to add that would crank up my routine. Some have suggested creatine, prohormones, and estrogen blockers. What do you guys think?

I really appreciate ya'lls help and advice
Rasta

 

[MS]

I honestly don't think that your goal is achievable without first gaining some more fat (ie bulking) followed by a fatloss program. I also think you may be doing too much hill running and would be better off doing some sprint work instead. If you're training legs twice in one week then you're likely not training them hard enough for optimal growth. Prohormones are like playing with fire and you will likely get mostly side effects with minimal muscle gain from taking them. If you use prohormones you may have to resort to taking tiny sublingual amounts every hour or two throughout the 24 hour day to get even close to something similar to a true AAS affect.

I can recommned creatine, and pharmaceutical estrogen blockers MAY help you gain weight with less fat, OR help you lose fat but you have to decide which you're going to do first. Achieving both at the same time at you %bf is not possible without AS IMHO.

Do you have any fat in your diet??

 

[rasta]

MS

Yea I have fat, I try to get it mostly from the fish that I eat, my omegas. I use virgin olive oil to cook with. I try to minimize my saturated fat intake, although I do eat a lot of red meat, usually once a day. I have heard of flaxseed oil, but I have heard that it tastes awful. Thought about taking the pill form, but heard it wasn't as good as shooting it from the bottle.

So, for a sprint session, how does using a track sprinting the straights and jogging or walking the curves sound? Or would cross training be a better idea. I used to do that for cardio. I would bike for 15min as hard as I could at a moderate resistance. I would then go to an elliptical type machine that uses both upper and lower body. I would focus on the upper body at a light resistance for 15 min. I would then go to the tread mill and run at 6 mile/hr for 5min walk at full incline at 4 mile/hr focusing on the glutes, and run at 7 mile/hr for 5min.

At my current workout routine I have managed to gain five lean pounds over a 3 month period. When training my legs, I train to the point of naseau or until my legs feel like they are going to buckle. Lots of squats!! I try and give a three day rest period between each leg day. I have managed to gain a lot of definition in my quads and some size in my hams, its the glutes and outer hip area (I want that little muscle that sticks out on the side of the glute near the top of the leg, like Susie Curry has) that I am having trouble with.

I think I will definitely invest in some creatine and see how it goes. I will take some time to talk to my physician about estrogen blockers and see how it goes. Any other advice on my training and diet are greatly appreciated.

I may one day consider aas, after I am in a position to no longer work the two jobs that I do, and after I feel like I have made all the possible gains and changes that I can naturally. Once I feel that I have tried everything, from different diets, training routines, and cardio, then I might make that leap.


Again, I really appreciate all of ya'lls advice. Keep it coming

Rasta

 

[rasta]

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