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Who are you listening to ?


Welcome to the EliteFitness.com Bodybuilding Site! Please join this discussion about Who are you listening to ? within the Weight Training & Weight Lifting category.

Excerpt: I've noticed that most people think that the bigger guys or those who lift the heavier weights detain the ultimate truth whether it be about training, diet, "supplements" or wathever subject more or less related to the gym If big guys can be very knowledgeable it's neither a prerequisite, nor a guarantee ! There are huge freaks who have no clue about proper nutrition and skinny guys who can give you the best advice about routines, exercices and juice and usually the big bastards that

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  1. #1
    anthrax's Avatar
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    Who are you listening to ?

    [it's inspired by wnt2bBeast's thread but not aimed at anyone]

    I've noticed that most people think that the bigger guys or those who lift the heavier weights detain the ultimate truth whether it be about training, diet, "supplements" or wathever subject more or less related to the gym

    If big guys can be very knowledgeable it's neither a prerequisite, nor a guarantee !

    There are huge freaks who have no clue about proper nutrition
    and skinny guys who can give you the best advice about routines, exercices and juice

    and usually the big bastards that show off the most are not the ones you should listen to
    If you don't shut your fucking mouth, I will kill you.

    Sport, truth, like art, is in the eye of the beholder. You believe what you choose and I'll believe what I know.
    Destiny is not a matter of chance, it is a matter of choice;
    it is not a thing to be waited for, it is a thing to be achieved.




  2. #2
    Elite Dementor WalkingBeast's Avatar
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    Re: Who are you listening to ?

    Ive learned alot from my uncle, who was massive at 280lbs and 23" arms at 12% bodyfat. Always been an inspiration. Id train with him in a tank top even though it made me feel like absolute shit when I was 17. That was always a humbling experience. Teaches you to look to the future rather then the present. Id keep the same weights on the machines he was using too. I was driven! When it comes down to it though, ultimately I do what works for me specifically. I take the best of what someone has to offer and I take parts of other advice and routines. Im also training naturally now, so the same things dont apply to me the same way. Its very different without AAS. That and the differences between individuals is great as well. So ultimately I try to listen to the way my body responds to different things. I cant hold as much food as many, because of my fucked up intestines, so I have to go about things in a different way. Im also very unconventional in my training and sleep schedule. Im nocturnal for the most part, often going to sleep around 7-9am and waking at 6pm or later. Also this rotates often. The way I train is often labeled as "severe overtraining" by many. My diet is also whatever I can eat to reach my protein baseline. I try to maintain atleast 200 grams of protein a day. Because of the many differences, no one will know you like you know yourself. Theres always more to learn though.
    Lifting Videos:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4A4lWT65ng

    Peak Measurements:
    5'8 242 lbs , cold flexed measurements: 56 chest, 19 1/2 arms, 29 quads, BIG waist

    KILL THAT SHlT


  3. #3
    Olympian
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    Re: Who are you listening to ?

    Like in anything, the most successful are not usually the best teachers or the most knowledgable. The best pro golfers listen to guru teaching pros who have fairly limited competitive success on their own. Some of the best strength and conditioning coaches in the world are marginal athletes when compared to those whom they are coaching.

    A long time ago I took a PT job in a gym for some summer money where one of the trainers was a bodybuilder (he earned his Pro card about 6 months later). We were talking one day and I asked him about his training and routines. His answer was "I do X sets for arms, Y sets for legs, Z sets for chest...." Right then I knew this guy didn't know anything more than the other noodlearms at the gym. It was drugs, diet, genetics and admittedly hard work but without the drugs he'd be just another guy running around wondering why he couldn't get bigger. His clients made little progress while every one of mine (even the slackers) was making very consistent month to month progress and more importantly felt self empowered in that they knew what needed to be done and were able to make progress under their own power (improves your whole outlook in life when you are out accomplishing a goal and making yourself better).

    Most people would look at this guy and look at me and choose him to train them any day. Then again, people who know what to look for would watch us both train - me doing cleans/snatches/pulls, a variety of squats and him doing leg presses, cables, machines, and BS isolation exercises training to failure - they'd know the truth instantly.

    EDIT: Anyway, people I listen to (authors/coaches/etc...not an exclusive list - just some names that come to mind):

    L. Simmons (WSBarbell)
    D. Tate (WSBarbell)
    G. Pendlay (IMO - one of the best strength coaches on the planet)
    B. Starr (One of the best strength coaches ever. Only the Strong Shall Survive - out of print, always loved reading his reprinted articles which where the only redeeming quality to the trash magazines in which they appeared)
    Medvedyev (researcher/author)
    Zatsiorsky (researcher/author)
    Siff (author)
    Laputin (researcher/author)
    Roman (researcher/author)
    Verkhoshansky (researcher/author)

    Some Good Readings:

    www.elitefts.com - Go to the books on training. You'll find the following (in no particular order):
    A System of Multi Year Training in Weightlifting
    Bigger Fast Stronger
    Fundmentals of Special Strength Training in Sport
    Supertraining (plus lots of others by Siff)
    Managing the Training of Weightlifters
    Science and Practice of Strength Training

    http://www.dynamic-eleiko.com/ - Go to Products, Sportivny Press Weightlifting Texts - Russian Weightlifting Library
    Here you'll find a number of translations from the above authors that are not available in Enligsh from anywhere else that I've found.

    http://www.deepsquatter.com/strength/archives/index.htm
    Nice collection of articles - excellent read.

    Some good discussion boards (I'm sure there are others too but these are some of the ones I tend to read on occasion if I'm feeling inclined):

    www.fortifiediron.com - some knowledgable people specifically in PLing, OLing, and Track and Field.

    www.mesomorphosis.com - their training board has a few people that are really great, particularly Johnsmith182 - be sure to check out the stickies and his tribute sticky in the training forum.

    www.goheavy.com - probably the best OLing forum on the internet with more coaching depth than anywhere else. Glenn Pendlay is a mod here.
    Last edited by Madcow2; 02-Jan-2005 at 12:20 AM.

  4. #4
    Chemical Wizard
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    Re: Who are you listening to ?

    Quote Quote posted by Anthrax
    [it's inspired by wnt2bBeast's thread but not aimed at anyone]

    I've noticed that most people think that the bigger guys or those who lift the heavier weights detain the ultimate truth whether it be about training, diet, "supplements" or wathever subject more or less related to the gym

    If big guys can be very knowledgeable it's neither a prerequisite, nor a guarantee !

    There are huge freaks who have no clue about proper nutrition
    and skinny guys who can give you the best advice about routines, exercices and juice

    and usually the big bastards that show off the most are not the ones you should listen to
    i agree with you a big person does not necessarily have the right training knowledge..he could have reat genetics or he has used a lot of drugs or both..

    I dont think nutrition is all that difficult to understand..im sure i can find one or two articles that can sum everything up for bulking or cutting..someone who has starved themselves to get below 7% and can barely lift weights its not a diet guru..

    As for me i read alot of the WSB articles and psend time on various PL boards..Whether i can squat 800 or 250 i dont think matters rather i try to help others achieve their goals..

    There are some good people on this board some i wish would post more often other less often lol

  5. #5
    Elite Dementor WalkingBeast's Avatar
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    Re: Who are you listening to ?

    I agree. Its one thing to achieve goals and another to instruct others. Also, one can become great at learning what works for them specifically, yet have little idea of what works best for others. You can imagine a person could become freakishly large and strong though experimentation without even understanding the mechanics of the human body or how a muscle even grows. A basement lifter with some possible chemical enhancement. Its one thing to achieve a result and another to understand it and teach it.
    Lifting Videos:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4A4lWT65ng

    Peak Measurements:
    5'8 242 lbs , cold flexed measurements: 56 chest, 19 1/2 arms, 29 quads, BIG waist

    KILL THAT SHlT


  6. #6
    Pro Bodybuilder
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    Re: Who are you listening to ?

    I dont listen to any one person, i try and take in information from all kinds of people, all shapes and sizes, and through trial and error find whats best for me. The huge freaks dont always know everything, and that skinny dude on the treadmill just might no something, you never know.

  7. #7
    Banned yomama's Avatar
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    Re: Who are you listening to ?

    I listen to my body.

  8. #8
    curgeo
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    Re: Who are you listening to ?

    Madcow....As I sit here and look over on my bookshelf, you just described almost every author or book I have on strength....with the exclusion of Pendlay of which I will research.

    Between "Supertraining", "Science and Practice of Strength Training", "A System of Multi-Year Training in Weightlifting and "Managine the Training of Weightlifters".......that is some amazing stuff. I wish people would look at stuff like that instead of Mens Health or the Fitness mags.

    A couple of years ago I was on my way to visit Dr Siff in his camp. 2 months before I was to fly to Colorado he passed away. I was sad in many respects. I looked at Mel as a mentor of sorts. I didn't know him except for our phone conversations, but was a really great guy. I miss him and the knowledge that I was to learn from him. His yahoo group is a great source of information. Very smart people on that board.

    I agree about Starr. The guys articles in that trash mag was the only reason I bought it. You can still get "Only The Strong Survive" from a couple of different places.

    I knew we spoke a similiar language.....LOL Thank you again for taking the time to critique my journal. I really appreciate the help.

  9. #9
    Olympian
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    Re: Who are you listening to ?

    Pendlay is a strength coach out of Wichita Falls. Coaches weightlifting, works with the USOC, has coached a variety of other athletes. He is really knowledgable. Sometimes I hit the Olympic Lifting forum at goheavy just to run a search and read his posts (that forum is really stacked with US Weightlifting coaches). Never met him in person nor have I spoken to him on the phone but I really like his methodologies and I find him to be a good solidly grounded down to earth guy from his posts. I don't believe he's competing anymore (was an OL most recently, had done some powerlifting) is just a monstrous guy. I think he was almost 380 - not ultra shredded (which is a bad choice for many competitive athletes) but not fat by any means. Animalmass on Meso (used to post on Fortified Iron and here as well on occasion - we started talking at the now defunked anabolicscience website) is a West Side lifter and is good friends with Glenn. You'd get along well with him, I don't know where he's posting right now but he has a very good foundation of knowledge in training.

    The admin at Fortified Iron (user name Fortified Iron - I can't remember his normal name right now - Matt I think?) is a fairly young guy and was a good friend of Siff's. Really looked up to him and took his passing pretty hard. There is a dedicated Supertraining forum there within the Advanced Training Theory Forum. You two might actually already know each other.

    I haven't visited Siff's yahoo group. Is it still running? I'll run a search in a bit but if you have a link, even better.

    Take care. MC

  10. #10
    curgeo
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    Re: Who are you listening to ?

    After Siff passed they decided to keep the site up and running.
    http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group...yguid=72708657

    I honestly believe anybody interested in functional strength could get alot out of that site.

    On Fortified Iron, I believe I posted a eulogy of sorts in honor of Mel. I don't know Matt, but I do know OF him. I frequent over there often.....but I just read. I can't post too many place...LOL

    I'm going to go over to goheavy today and check out Pendlay's stuff. A search should bring up most of his posts.

    You know, there is so much to learn. A couple friends of mine train at Nazareth and have invited me out to train for a couple of days. If I didn't work so much I would, I just have to find a time to go. It is really a plus to have people to talk to about this as I didn't have anything but useless bodybuilding knowledge prior to a year or two ago. I guess that is why I try and read as much as I can and aquire the advise of people that I think know what they are talking about...(such as yourself).

    Mc,are you going to the Arnold this year? If you go you have a couple of beers bought by yours truely.

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