I want to start doing Pendlay rows instead of conventional rows

[Xlajbf]

Sorry for the potentially stupid question... my 5RM for conventional rows is 200lbs (~91kg). How much should I be able to Pendlay Row given that number?

I've never done Pendlay rows before and keep hearing that they are better than conventional rows, so I'd like to switch. That, and conventional rows are starting to strain my back a bit. I think the deweighting and the necessity to bend my knees more to keep my back parallel to the floor and still reach the bar on the floor will take some of the load off.

Are Pendlay Rows necessarily easier on the back than conventional rows? I have a bulging lumbar disc and deadlifting 300lbs is scary enough for me. I don't want to put myself at any greater risk for injury.

Thanks

 

[perp69]

Well if by conventional rows you mean something like T-bar rows at a 45 angle then I think Pendlay rows may be more uncomfortable on your lower back since you will be more parallel. But most people that have never done them have to use less weight in the begining so the decrease in weight may take some stress off your back. However, I think Pendlay rows are much better for the back development. You can get up to 300 on them but it takes awhile. Anyway try them for a bit and see how they do for you. Some soreness is to be expected. I still get a sore back on occassion and been doing them for 2.5 years.

Perp

 

[Kabeetz]

Honestly I think pendlay rows and even deadlifting should probably not be performed if you have a very specific, current back issue.

On the other hand, I am completely against neglecting an area of your body because of an injury or giving up a certain exercise for life... I think that only exacerbates (sp?) a condition. BUT.. please use caution and remember that your back should be getting better, not worse, and if that's not the case than u need to pull back or try something different temporarily.

Also, do not take that as my "advice", that's strictly my own opinion/common sense thrown out there for you to consider. Be careful mang.

 

[blut wump]

All I can suggest is that you take it very carefully until you've developed the supporting musculature to hold yourself comfortably parallel to the floor and perform Pendlay rows. I'm 100% with Kabeetz on this.

That said, if you know your own limits and have the ability to work within them then working the area to enhance the musculature there can help to support the spine.

I'm not familiar with all the implications of a bulging disc but isn't there a perpetual danger of the thing just bursting under load?

 

[Tweakle]

I would honestly not be doing that if you have a disc problem, unless you have a bulletproof back.. and if pulling 300 is scary for you I don't imagine your back is strong enough to compensate for the injury.

my favorite row varient is chest supported, hips and abs on a flat bench propped up on steppers with your legs astride the steppers. Keeps you strict and prevents hip thrust

 

[Xlajbf]

Ok maybe I should have been more descriptive of my disc problem before throwing it out there.

I injured my lower back in October of 2005 deadlifting. I was deadlifting 225 at the time. I had been deadlifting in the mid 300s before that and apparently just started deadlifting too high after a long layoff without warming up properly. Oopsy. Stupid.

Turns out I ended up with a bulging (not herniated) L4-L5 lumbar disc. I did not lift for 3 months. When I started lifting again in early 2006, I started deadlifting a massive 30lbs. Yes 30lbs. Smallest possible weight I could find. I went up by 10lbs per week until I was eventually able to deadlift more than the weight that originally injured me without any discomfort.

Now I am deadlifting 300lbs as my 5RM. My back feels sore for 2 or 3 days afterwards, but it's the typical soreness I'd expect from an intense workout rather than the sharp pain I will never forget from a year ago. I can squat 350x5 with no pain, no lower back pain when military pressing, and no lower back pain after a round of golf with my ridiculously high handicap (i.e a lot of swings of the golf club).

That said, hunching over with 200lbs in a conventional barbell row was starting to worry me. I though Pendlay Rows might be "better" on the back since I deweight each rep and don't have the constant pressure on the lower back.

I tried doing them today with 135lbs as the 5 rep working set after warmup. My lats felt worked out, but so did my lower back (sore, not in pain).

By "deadlifting 300lbs is scary enough for me" I mean "man this is 75lbs over the weight that hurt my back... I hope I don't snap in two" not "omg my back hurts so much. I'm a moron for trying to lift this weight... oh well, 4 reps to go!"

Having read all that, do you maintain your originally opinions or do you think I'll be OK?

 

[Kabeetz]

If you start low, progress slowly, and look for the signs that f'd you up in the first place, there's no reason you can't bring your row along as you have your dead. It sounds like you are nearing completion of rehab, not working out with an f'd up, untreated back. If that is the case.. I would imagine some of the knowledgable bro's on here would tell you to go for it.

 

[perp69]

Really sounds like to me you would be ok if you take it easy and just slowly workup your way up. Like I said you won't be doing 300lbs over night anyway. Pendlay rows are a great exercise if you are able to them but no exercise is worth srugery so listen to your body. How does the discomfort you are having now compare to when your disk was bulging?

Perp

 

[blut wump]

Always let the discomfort be your guide. I used to fear deadlifts for similar reasons with thoughts that my upper half would just slide off my legs about half-way up. think you'll be fine with Pendlay rows and that the exercise can be part of your ongoing rehab and posterior chain strenghtening.

 

[Y_lifter]

Real bad back and bent over rows =

Using a bench set at an incline, just enough so that you can lay face down on the bench with your arm pits just at the top and almost touch the floor.

Set the BB on the ground below your arms, reach down and do the standard row bringing the BB up to the bottom of the bench.
All pressure will be off of your mid/lower back and supported by the bench you are lying on. Works with DB as well for reverse fly movement.