Peace of mind for $90?

[VooDoo Lady]

After reading MS's thread, I PM'd Ulter about the testing....I figured the deal MS was getting was something special on the side...I mean $90? That's CHEAP!

I couldn't believe it when Ulter told me I could have lab results on the pills within a week for $90.00.

It left me wondering...why do we spend so much time speculating as to what's *really* in IP Anavar or whether Loeffler is properly dosed?

Why don't more people take advantage of the resource and get everything tested...for the bargain basement price of $90.00?

I am *assuming* that MS has done her homework and Ulter is a trustworthy resource.....

Peace of mind is worth far more than $90 to me!

Thoughts?

 

[Temple]

That Ulter is a pretty shady character so I think we had better keep a close eye on him
Actually, VDL - I agree it is a great deal and will gladly chip in for any testing the board wants to have done and seriously, there is no need to worry about Ulter.

 

[The Shadow]

The price is fair as the tester knows upfront what it is being analyzed for. A blind test by GC/MS would cost 2-3 times that amount.

GC/MS testing is the ONLY way to test a truly "blind" sample - ie - where the tester is not pre-biased by knowing what the analyte in question is.

 

[starfish]

The price is fair as the tester knows upfront what it is being analyzed for. A blind test by GC/MS would cost 2-3 times that amount.

GC/MS testing is the ONLY way to test a truly "blind" sample - ie - where the tester is not pre-biased by knowing what the analyte in question is.

How does he know what is being tested for, if I don't tell him until after

 

[starfish]

After reading MS's thread, I PM'd Ulter about the testing....I figured the deal MS was getting was something special on the side...I mean $90? That's CHEAP!

I couldn't believe it when Ulter told me I could have lab results on the pills within a week for $90.00.

It left me wondering...why do we spend so much time speculating as to what's *really* in IP Anavar or whether Loeffler is properly dosed?

Why don't more people take advantage of the resource and get everything tested...for the bargain basement price of $90.00?

I am *assuming* that MS has done her homework and Ulter is a trustworthy resource.....

Peace of mind is worth far more than $90 to me!

Thoughts?

Voo Doo Lady I agree...


Even if someone posts a lab test of a brand they bought, it does not mean the same stuff is in YOUR bottle of the same brand

 

[The Shadow]

How does he know what is being tested for, if I don't tell him until after

We are talking about the anavar - yes. I remember reading that Ulter knew what it was supposed to be.....

....btw - if the tester truly did not know what the compound was - the results HAVE to be by GC/MS for confirnmation...

 

[starfish]

We are talking about the anavar - yes. I remember reading that Ulter knew what it was supposed to be.....

....btw - if the tester truly did not know what the compound was - the results HAVE to be by GC/MS for confirnmation...

Yes, we are mostly talking about anavar.... but that doesn't mean something else could not be sent... to test the accuracy of the tester.

What does GC/MS for confirmation mean??

 

[The Shadow]

Yes, we are mostly talking about anavar.... but that doesn't mean something else could not be sent... to test the accuracy of the tester.

What does GC/MS for confirmation mean??

GC/MS is the same tech used to test for doping in the IOC.


GC/MS is used when a smple is "blind".

The unknown is disolved in a solvent of choice and injected where it becomes vaporized. As it passed thru the magic box(MS detector) - it is bombarded with w/electrons.

Each compound has a unique fragmentation pattern. IE - hitting a watermelon ala Gallagher and a particular watermelon explodes in exactly the same exact way every single time.


Make sense?

I would send a blind sample as well........

 

[VooDoo Lady]

Make sense?

I would send a blind sample as well........

no... Doesn't make sense.

Dumb this down for me

 

[The Shadow]

1. - you want to know if the sample is......anavar
2 - you TELL the tester it is supposed to be anavar
3 - bad mistake
4 - the tester should tell YOU what it is and the mg quantity
5 - send a sample of....say a oral winny and tell hin you have no clue what it is and see if he is actualy doing the testing in the correct way

 

[starfish]

1. - you want to know if the sample is......anavar
2 - you TELL the tester it is supposed to be anavar
3 - bad mistake
4 - the tester should tell YOU what it is and the mg quantity
5 - send a sample of....say a oral winny and tell hin you have no clue what it is and see if he is actualy doing the testing in the correct way

I completely agree.... The tester should not KNOW what he is hoping to find.

If you are paying money, the tester could tell you what you want to hear. Wether it is the truth or not.

 

[VooDoo Lady]

Got cha.........

I wouldn't do that anyway (tell the tester what it is..)...Kinda leaves you WIDE open for getting ripped off...

 

[MS]

Cornholio is correct. The tests that we are talking about are confirmation tests. We tell the tester that we want to know how much of substance X (anavar) is in the sample. This tells us nothing about anything else that might also be in the sample. This is not as good as the GC/MS method used for doping control since it will not tell us, for instance, that the anavar we just tested also has a lot of winstrol in it.

BUT this test is much cheaper than a blind GC/MS. And if everyone is getting great results from, let's say, Bratis ox, but it only has 5 mg of ox per 10mg tablet, you can be sure you're getting ripped off! On the other hand, if it has 10, 12 or even more ox in it, then you can be pretty confident that it is not laced with anything else and you're getting your money's worth.

As far as testing every single bottle that each person orders, it makes much more sense to pool our resources and test a batch of each brand of ox from a particular supplier. I have a feeling a lot of you gals get your stuff from a few of the more reliable suppliers so sharing this info would be useful for many of you. This way we can test the BTG, tt, Bratis, Loeffler, etc from supplier X, Y, and Z and see if it's legit ox at a reasonable dose. If you're thinking about spending $250 on a bottle of ox, why not spend an extra $5 or $10 on contributing to getting it tested..........

 

[The Shadow]

Being a GC/MS jockey I would be most interested in seeing the actual hardcopy if possible

 

[MS]

Do you mean 'hardcopy' as in the original, or do you mean a photocopy/scanned image of the original?? The results are in this format:
http://www.anabolicfitness.net/images/spox.jpg

 

[starfish]

To be honest, any test that is done is worthless to me...

UNLESS, it is on the anavar I'm going to use..

Otherwise, I don't see the point.

If a Bratis OX test comes back with AWESOME results, it still does not mean that is what is in all bottles of Bratis OX.

 

[The Shadow]

Do you mean 'hardcopy' as in the original, or do you mean a photocopy/scanned image of the original?? The results are in this format:
http://www.anabolicfitness.net/images/spox.jpg

That is fine but I want to know what was used as the standard to compare the anavar to.

 

[The Shadow]

"We" have been working on testing for a long while now. There is MUCH more involved than you all realize. We are NOT handling over the counter aspirin here folks.

I'm a chemist - believe me I know.

 

[VooDoo Lady]

And please do not go e-mailing Ulter.......

If I wanted to send him $90 of my money and one of my pills, that wouldn't be.....ok? He was very nice when I inquired and even gave me additional info to move forward with testing.

 

[Temple]

To be honest, any test that is done is worthless to me...

UNLESS, it is on the anavar I'm going to use..

Otherwise, I don't see the point.

If a Bratis OX test comes back with AWESOME results, it still does not mean that is what is in all bottles of Bratis OX.

Yeah but you could even take that a step further and say that even if one pill in your bottle tested good half or more of them could be junk. Some of this we just have to take on faith and the results that we see in our bodies. A random sample will give us some idea of what it is or isn't.

 

[starfish]

Yeah but you could even take that a step further and say that even if one pill in your bottle tested good half or more of them could be junk. Some of this we just have to take on faith and the results that we see in our bodies. A random sample will give us some idea of what it is or isn't.

That's true.... But the chances of me picking the one true anavar tablet or bunk tablet out of my bottle are pretty slim..


I think testing is an AWESOME idea... But I think it would be naive to think that everyones Bratis (or whatever) is the same just because someone tests theirs.




Anyway, I hope there is some testing available soon. There is a reason I want to do mine

 

[MS]

There are all sorts of levels of paranoia you can develop. But if you're that concerned about the batch to batch variablility of the same drug from the same supplier, then maybe you should consider if taking illegally obtained drugs is really worth the risks/hassles/cost. I dunno about you guys, but I think $90 is A LOT of money to spend even once to test once batch of 100 tabs. And BTW, the testing procedure requires 5 tabs, so there goes 1/20th of every bottle you buy just for testing. Of course, this gives you some idea of the variability from one tab to the next, which can be pretty important for females looking to minimize sides. If one tab is 5mg, and the next one is 15, it may average out to 10mg, but you're not getting very consistent dosing. This is less important for a male taking 4,5 or even 6 tabs per day. This is prolly my biggest reservation about paper products. Though I haven't tested them, I'm 100% certain that there will be dramatic variation from 1 square to the next. It's just the nature of the way it's processed and applied. I think paper is fine for the guys (it's reputedly 10% overdosed), but maybe a little risky for the gals.

Starfish, I agree that my bratis may not be the same as your bratis (or whatever). But testing bratis from particular suppliers will allow us to accumulate a database of good sources and bad sources for different drugs. In other words, it will help us to help you decide where to buy your next batch of oxandrolone from, rather than you taking pot luck from where ever you can get it. And believe me, the more reputable suppliers are also eager to see their products tested. They don't want to sell bogus gear any more than you want to buy bogus gear..........

Anyway, I get the feeling that a lot of folks have strong reservations about the whole idea of collective testing. I think it's a shame because this board is one of the few places where us "consumers" have the opportunity to take some control over what we purchase and whether or not we're getting ripped off. Illegal AAS supply is one of the biggest rip off games in the US. Chances are that many of us on this board have already been unknowingly ripped off, and will continue to be, without a collective effort to QA what we put in our bodies.

 

[starfish]

There are all sorts of levels of paranoia you can develop. But if you're that concerned about the batch to batch variablility of the same drug from the same supplier, then maybe you should consider if taking illegally obtained drugs is really worth the risks/hassles/cost. I dunno about you guys, but I think $90 is A LOT of money to spend even once to test once batch of 100 tabs. And BTW, the testing procedure requires 5 tabs, so there goes 1/20th of every bottle you buy just for testing. Of course, this gives you some idea of the variability from one tab to the next, which can be pretty important for females looking to minimize sides. If one tab is 5mg, and the next one is 15, it may average out to 10mg, but you're not getting very consistent dosing. This is less important for a male taking 4,5 or even 6 tabs per day. This is prolly my biggest reservation about paper products. Though I haven't tested them, I'm 100% certain that there will be dramatic variation from 1 square to the next. It's just the nature of the way it's processed and applied. I think paper is fine for the guys (it's reputedly 10% overdosed), but maybe a little risky for the gals.

Starfish, I agree that my bratis may not be the same as your bratis (or whatever). But testing bratis from particular suppliers will allow us to accumulate a database of good sources and bad sources for different drugs. In other words, it will help us to help you decide where to buy your next batch of oxandrolone from, rather than you taking pot luck from where ever you can get it. And believe me, the more reputable suppliers are also eager to see their products tested. They don't want to sell bogus gear any more than you want to buy bogus gear..........

Anyway, I get the feeling that a lot of folks have strong reservations about the whole idea of collective testing. I think it's a shame because this board is one of the few places where us "consumers" have the opportunity to take some control over what we purchase and whether or not we're getting ripped off. Illegal AAS supply is one of the biggest rip off games in the US. Chances are that many of us on this board have already been unknowingly ripped off, and will continue to be, without a collective effort to QA what we put in our bodies.

I don't do tons of AS and I'm not planning on it... $90.00 is cheap if it would give me peace of mind... It's really cheap compared to what some people around here spend on supplements and stuff.


Besides, the more people who test, the better off it will be.

The simple IDEA that we are testing is probably going to make possible scammers think twice... Also, VERY reliable sources could have something happen, I'm sure they would want to know.

 

[starfish]

There are all sorts of levels of paranoia you can develop. But if you're that concerned about the batch to batch variablility of the same drug from the same supplier, then maybe you should consider if taking illegally obtained drugs is really worth the risks/hassles/cost. I dunno about you guys, but I think $90 is A LOT of money to spend even once to test once batch of 100 tabs. And BTW, the testing procedure requires 5 tabs, so there goes 1/20th of every bottle you buy just for testing. Of course, this gives you some idea of the variability from one tab to the next, which can be pretty important for females looking to minimize sides. If one tab is 5mg, and the next one is 15, it may average out to 10mg, but you're not getting very consistent dosing. This is less important for a male taking 4,5 or even 6 tabs per day. This is prolly my biggest reservation about paper products. Though I haven't tested them, I'm 100% certain that there will be dramatic variation from 1 square to the next. It's just the nature of the way it's processed and applied. I think paper is fine for the guys (it's reputedly 10% overdosed), but maybe a little risky for the gals.

You said that every test requires 5 tablets....

Well, get 5 ladies with Bratis to contribute $$ and a tablet and 5 people get their stuff tested...


That's better than nothing.

 

[Temple]

MS - I don't understand the reservations about testing. It is still going to come down to knowing your source. I find it hard to believe that we would want to just randomly take things when some level of testing can be done and I would like to see as many things tested as we can get funds raised for i.e. let me know what is next and I will gladly kick in for that as well.

 

[starfish]

Voodoo, by all means if Ulter is cool with it then no problems. I just didn't want him to get flodded with tons of questions.

Testing is a step in the right direction. Is it the majic bullet to determine the quality of our goods - No.

There are soooo many pit falls and games that can be played. Say a few tabs of Ttokkyo comes back bad. Well, who's to blame? The source, the company, or even the individual who is pissed at a source and sends in crap? Or even a source who can't carry said products so tried to undermind that brand to cut sales.

On the other hand lets say that Ttokkyo come back with dead on dosing. Now EVERYONE flocks to Ttokkyo because it has been "proven" good. Well, now scammers can do the 50% swap out every day, day in day out and point to the lab test for cover.

Lets say Ttokkyo only comes back with an average of 6mg per tab. Well that dose not really mean it's bad, just underdosed. Now you have to look at the price. Is it still worth it? Many if not all Mexican steriods are underdosed. But price per mg, they still beat the Euro hands down.

The worst case would be if the tabs came back with 1 or 2 mg, but everyone still gets good gains. Now we have a problem as there is something else in there. Which could be part of the same sitch as I mentioned above - as in who is to blame?!?!

I agree... If a sample came back with funky results, you could not necessarily blame your source. It could be the maker, someone in between, etc. I think good sources would be interested in testing results too.

Of course, we could all just go natural and not have to worry about it LOL!!