getting a post secondary education

[Lao Tzu]

A degree is necessary to get a job. however, you can always go through a diploma mill (if they still exist) and get a fake, but real sounding B.S., Ph.D. or M.A..

I enjoy college myself. I learn better when i have a reason to learn.

when did you start studying math. i thought you were pre-med (i may have been thinking of someone else).

 

[mattcanning99]

A degree is necessary to get a job. however, you can always go through a diploma mill (if they still exist) and get a fake, but real sounding B.S., Ph.D. or M.A..

I enjoy college myself. I learn better when i have a reason to learn.

when did you start studying math. i thought you were pre-med (i may have been thinking of someone else).

nope...math...i've lost my intrinsic interest tho...maybe my heart will come back into it soon, you never know

 

[buddy28]

Warik

the point vinlygroover is trying to make is that not ALL people can learn as easily as you.

Therefore, your conclusion that all college or post secondary education is a waste of time is a fallacy since most students require a personal instructor in addition to book learning.

College, or university, in my opinion is a great experience. U get personal instruction, ur immersed and surrounded by persons taking and teaching your selected discpline. Its a great place to learn.

U seem to be alittle put off because it costly. Thats a caveat of the United States education system, not post secondary institutions

 

[Warik]

Did you read my whole post brightass???

You dont understand how normal employment works, do you? Gaining employment for jobs other than computer programming, or sales, require the applicant to *demonstrate* a sufficent level of problem solving, analyitical, and writing skills, in addition to a satisfactory level of knowledge associated with the position being applied for.

Because we dont live in a society where everyone knows everyone else, the method used to certify the possession of the required knowledge base and analytical skills is a degree. SURPRISE!!!! Makes sense, doesnt it?

Did YOU read MY post? I AM NOT SPEAKING OF THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE JOB MARKET AS IT IS TODAY. What is so difficult to understand?

Do you need a college degree to be a chemist? By the "rules" governing the chemistry field, YES.

Do you need a college degree to be a teacher? By the "rules" governing the teaching field, YES.

But, do you "NEED" a degree to do these jobs? The answer is NO.

If I were to walk into an 6th grade classroom right now and start teaching algebra, would I be COMPLETELY unable to succeed in doing so unless I had a piece of paper that said "Warik sat in a chair for 4 years and listened to people talk about math?" Seeing as how my math knowledge vastly exceeds that which is taught in a 6th grade classroom, the answer is no. I would not be unable to succeed. On the contrary, I'd easily be able to do the job.

If you can't understand the difference between "need" in terms of requirements to get a job and "need" in terms of requirements to DO the job, then perhaps a few semesters of college may not do you any harm.

Chemist not needing a degree. Hmmm......you think your smarter then the CEOs of Merke Fizer? Right.....

Seeing as how I'm not a chemist, nor have I had more than a basic education in chemistry, no, I'm not smarter than the CEOs, nor do I claim to be. The real question to ask is, are those CEOs so smart because they went to college for a few years, or are they so smart because they busted their asses for the years following to get where they are today? By your logic, a person fresh out of college with a chemistry degree is just as smart as those CEOs.

Hell, by your logic, that punk dropout Bill Gates is just a stupid little kid compared to my professor. My professor went to college!

-Warik

 

[BaBa-BooeY]

Hell, by your logic, that punk dropout Bill Gates is just a stupid little kid compared to my professor. My professor went to college!

-Warik

 

[Warik]

the point vinlygroover is trying to make is that not ALL people can learn as easily as you.

This I do not dispute. I can think of several examples of the top of my head that make your claim valid.

However, if my ability to learn outside of the college environment is equal to or greater than another person's ability to learn inside the college environment, why am I required to suffer through the inefficient teaching methods of the University system?

If you're running a race and are the fastest runner on the track, do you wait for everyone else to catch up before crossing the finish line?

Therefore, your conclusion that all college or post secondary education is a waste of time is a fallacy

My conclusion is that all college or post secondary education is a waste of time for me and people like me. I challenge you to prove that is a fallacy.

College, or university, in my opinion is a great experience. U get personal instruction, ur immersed and surrounded by persons taking and teaching your selected discpline. Its a great place to learn.

It's too distracting for my tastes. Having so many people in the same room is not a good learning environment. Many professors lack sufficient teaching skill. I learn better in a comfortable reclining chair with my feet on the desk and a keyboard in my lap looking at websites and writing code. My recent Data Structures course experience has been writing programs to perform various sorting algorithms, and taking a test that requires me to create a binary search tree out of the months of the year. I already know how sorting algorithms work, and if I forget, they are available everywhere - why do I need to waste my time writing them again? I already know how to make a binary search tree. Why do I have to prove it to the professor?

U seem to be alittle put off because it costly.

Nope. My views have nothing to do with the price tag. My college education is totally free - books included. Plus I get an extra $750-$1,000 per semester tax free to go straight into my pocket. Ahhh... academic scholarships - without them, whites would never get free shit.

I'd be glad to discuss this more at length tomorrow, but I must go to sleep, as I have class at 9:30am. Imagine all of the important things I could get done now if I didn't have to go to sleep to wake up for that wasteful shit.

-Warik

 

[buddy28]

The point here is the fact that college degrees for most professions are unnecessary. That is, they should NOT be necessary.

Should you need a degree to be a math teacher? An English teacher? A social studies teacher? ANY kind of teacher? No.

They SHOULD be necessary in order to ascertain the applicants compentency for the applied position.

Yes, in a perfect world, no one should need a degree. But you fail to realise we dont live in a perfect world.

Warik, you dont even know what the fuck your talking about when it comes to logic. In my post, as I explicity stated, degrees are a highly usefull tool for an employer to verify the applicants compentecy in his selected feild of study.

OF COURSE a degree doesnt imply ultimate intelligence. OF COURSE the absence of a degree doesnt affirm a lack of intelligence. But what it does do, and does well, is confirm to future employers a demonstrated compentancy in the selected feild of study + basic analyitical and problem solving skills using an objective, qualified, third party rater.

Specilization of labor was created because its more efficent for one person to do one thing, then 10 different things. Universities were created, and sustained by this very princible. People REALISE that going to a university, and yes, paying the money for enrollment, is far superior option then everyone not going to university and employers having to make a comprehensive exam testing everything from basic knowledge to problem solving skills to written and oral articulation and expression --- specialized for every fucking job position out there.

Gets alittle inefficent. y are u even arguing this??

 

[vinylgroover]

Warik,

You are a first class idiot.

Getting an education is not about being 'smart' as you put it. What does having an education have to do with being smart. An education merely gives people the opportunity to further themselves and improve their plight in life so they don't have to work in dingy sweat shops or beg or whatever else.

How do you know a rapper or professional athlete is dumb as shit?

It's not about being smart it's about learning and improving one's opportunities in life (not just getting a job).

Wake up to yourself, for your own sake

 

[Zirakzigil]

BTW, Warik's entire premise is flawed. It is possible to get high-end jobs without a degree, and for the truly intelligent, it's extremely easy (c.f. a guy I work with who graduated high school at 16 and went directly to work for IBM). I must conclude that if Warik can't do this, he's not quite as intelligent as he thinks he is. Seriously Warik, go apply at some software companies - if you don't want to waste your time frittering away at finding isomorphisms, don't. You'll get a lower entry wage, but by the time you would have graduated from college, you'll have been working for a few years and you'll be making a very similar if not higher amount, especially since you'll do such great work because of your intelligence.

 

[buddy28]

However, if my ability to learn outside of the college environment is equal to or greater than another person's ability to learn inside the college environment, why am I required to suffer through the inefficient teaching methods of the University system?

Dont go to class. If your as smart as you think you are, you should be able to skip class and show up for exams. Thats what i did.

My conclusion is that all college or post secondary education is a waste of time for me and people like me. I challenge you to prove that is a fallacy.

Im not arguing college is a waste of time for extremely gifted people. I have no proof ur extremely gifted, and even if u were, y would I want to argue that?? That wasnt my intial argument, nor will it be.