Hows about this type of whole body program 3x/week?

After years of doing Crossfit I went back to a 3x5 routine and quite enjoyed it. I've reached a point where I want to take the core exercises and do them each workout. Essentially:

Squat 3x5
Weighted Dips 3x5
Deadlift 2x5
Weighted Chins 3x5

Linear progression on each every workout (or once a week...havent decided yet). I would alternate front and back squats every workout.

Thats it. I am and always have been against things like curls, calf raises, and all the other (IMO) bullshit assistance exercises, so a traditional "bodybuilding split" wont work for me. My shoulders seem to get hit well enough with the above (I took a few weeks off of any type of shoulder exercise a few months ago, and when getting back into them I was able to jump weight on my press as if I had been doing them all along).

I know that most people will talk about CNS overkill with squats and deads 3x per week, but I eat well enough and have never had symptoms of overtraining while doing deads 2x/week. Plus, I just love doing them.

Thoughts?

I think you should try it and see. If you make progress on the lifts then its working.

However, if you do have trouble with overtraining one thing I would suggest is pulling heavy conventional deadlifts one workout, then skipping deadlifts on the second workout. Then for the third workout something like a romanian deadlift for higher reps (around 10 reps). Doing differant variations of deadlifts twice a week is one thing, but I wouldnt want to pull heavy every single workout.

I have been able to recover from heavy RDL and heavy conventional DL in the same week.

Out of interest, why no bench?

shoulders? chest? arms? abs? back width? (deadlifts are great for back thickness, but you need pulldowns or pullups for back width)

I do not belive deadlifts are enough to build arms, shoulders and chest...not even close.

Also you wont lift any serious weight deadlifting anf squating 3 times a week...it will take you too long to recover and you'll have one good workout the entire work. You are better off following a more conventional training system that has been proven to work, i.e. 5x5, DC, Max OT, FST-7, etc...

the_alcatraz said:

shoulders? chest? arms? abs? back width? (deadlifts are great for back thickness, but you need pulldowns or pullups for back width)

I do not belive deadlifts are enough to build arms, shoulders and chest...not even close.

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Shoulders = dips/chins
Arms = dips/chins/deads
abs = people still "work" those? Squats, deads, and weighted chins take care of that.

Id alternate pullups and chins (weighted, of course).

As for arms, I think the last time I did a curl, pressdown/extension, or whatever the exercise du jour is for arms was 2001.

the_alcatraz said:

Also you wont lift any serious weight deadlifting anf squating 3 times a week...it will take you too long to recover and you'll have one good workout the entire work. You are better off following a more conventional training system that has been proven to work, i.e. 5x5, DC, Max OT, FST-7, etc...

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Thats the thing...I'm kind of basing this off of the reasoning behind Ripptoe's starting strength, for instance.

The only main difference between what I have here and SS/5x5 is I would do deads every workout instead of every other. Dips are a perfectly good (and sometimes superior) substitute for bench, and pretty much all of the programs you mentioned include chins/pullups in one fashion or another. Those workouts go fine along with the linear progression.

Essentially the big question is will an extra 2 sets of deads per week really hinder my progress.

ExtraMile said:

However, if you do have trouble with overtraining one thing I would suggest is pulling heavy conventional deadlifts one workout, then skipping deadlifts on the second workout. Then for the third workout something like a romanian deadlift for higher reps (around 10 reps). Doing differant variations of deadlifts twice a week is one thing, but I wouldnt want to pull heavy every single workout.

Click to expand...

Thats a good idea...alternating high and low reps on deads, attempting to increase weight every other (or every 4th workout).

Out of interest, why no bench?

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I'm not competing in a powerlifting meet any time soon. I havent benched more than sporadically in a while now, and yet my chest continues to develop and get stronger. From Oct through Dec of last year, I did only weighted dips yet my 5rm on bench increased 15lbs.

Give it a try then bro, worst comes to the worst you get burned out and take a week off. Then at least you learn something new about the work capacity you can handle. Only way you'll truly find out is to try it out.

I doubt you will build massive amounts of mass in just a few areas of the body and leave massive gaping holes in the areas you didnt fully isolate unless you are planning on using this exact routine for the next 5 years lol.... or if you plan on competing in bodybuilding which Im pretty certain your not.

You may find as certain lifts stall you end up tweaking the routine bit by bit and eventually it ends up looking nothing like the original plan and yet you are still getting results from it, thats just how you learn to train for certain goals imo.

I would never do the routine you posted myself, but the way I see it theres not much to loose by giving it a go for a while...

Or perhaps alternate heavy (eg 3x5, linear progression) workouts with -25% load workouts for higher reps.

EG Monday 3x5 across
Wed 3x8 across
Fri 3x5 across with progression

You need to realize starting strength is predominantly about teaching new lifters how to lift and use a simple, but effective program that can be built up as they advance in strength.

Rippetoe is not opposed to assistance exercises if they serve a real purpose and are effective. The intermediate stage of lifting ie. when you transition from making gains every workout to making gains once a week or so is the best time to start using assistance lifts.

To build a strong, attractive, functional body you do not need alot of assistance exercises, but you do need some or the smaller muscles can actually hinder the big lifts.

At a minimum I would recommend shoulder pressing for a different angle of pressing than just dips, some strict pressdowns to assist in strengthening the triceps in an isolated fashion because they may not be getting maximally fatigued in the compound lifts. Back extensions, leg curls, decline situps, sidebends etc will all help the big lifts.

Assistance exercises shouldn't be shunned. They aren't that taxing either because they should be performed as "assistance" lifts with lighter weight and strict form. Sets of 3x8-12 being ideal. I just did an assistance workout tonight after benching and squatting heavy on monday and tuesday and basically just did decline situps, db sidebends, lying leg raises, back extension and some curls. All for 3 sets of 10. I got some muscle fatigue and blood flow into the muscles and will add a little weight next time. Wasn't particularly taxed from the workout, but rather invigorated and it was beneficial.

There will come a point if you are only doing nothing, but the basic compound lifts that you will get strong enough that you will either injure yourself because the assistance muscles haven't been getting taxed enough or you will stall out because these smaller muscles are becoming weak links. It's just the way it is.

This doesn't mean bookoo assistance. For my bench I'll do close grips or decline dumbells and strict cable pressdowns to make sure the triceps get isolated.

For squats I'll do some high rep leg presses and some abductor/adductor work.

For deads I'll use back extensions, db rows, stiff legged deads etc.

Doesn't have to be alot, but you need to shore up the big muscles. You're only as strong as your weakest link.

P.S. Also, your abs do get a good workout from heavy squats, presses and deads, but they get accustomed to this very fast. They can be made even stronger with a little direct attention and this is really beneficial when you're squatting or deadlifting +400lbs as it will help keep you solid.