final word on ALA ...

[XzRzX]

so what brand of ALA is really the best all around ( effectivity price etc. ) ? ... im thinking of either buying Jarrows, Nutriteam ALA (Nature's Purest) or the r-ALA from anabolicfitness ...

if i would take the r-ala ... how much do i take per meal if i usually take around 900-1200 mg per meal of ALA ( based on the ALA i bought from Natures Purest, Nutriteam )

thanks !

 

[MR. BMJ]

In most of the studies involving the 2 racemic enantiomers the r-ala appears to be superior to the s-ALA. However, this does not totally make the s-ALA worthless or dangerous, as I have seen posted. I have seen NO studies showing the s-ALA enantiomer to be harmful...If anyone has any info refuting this, then I would be happy to take a look at it. The thing you want to keep in mind is the cost factor. Many people have still gotten great results from using the mixed 1:1 ratio. However, those who don't, may be getting their supply from an unhonost supplier. I have been taking the 100mg. ALA from "Spring Valley" and it is great. Best thing about this is that it only cost like $6 at Wal Mart. If taking the 2 enantiomers is cheaper than using only the r-ala enantiomer, then stick with the mixed.

BMJ

 

[XzRzX]

thanks ... but i seem to have posted this on the wrong forum hehehe sowwwy

how much are you taking in per day MR. BMJ ?

 

[Mr H]

When studies are done, they only use r-ALA.

So I'd say stick with r-ALA....

 

[Ulter]

The problem is not that simple. The s actually negates some of the positive aspects of the r and one of them is insulin regulation. The argument that "all you have to do is buy more of the mix" doesn't hold water because most of the mixes are not dosed 50-50 and you don't even know how much r-ALA you're getting.

 

[Ulter]

There was never really any argument about whether or not r-ALA is superior. It just never mattered because you couldn't get it. Now you can. Check out this thread.

http://www.elitefitness.com/forum/showthread.php?threadid=151547

 

[MR. BMJ]

Well i'll be damn, look at good ol' ULTER on the diet board...

My main concern is with the strength comparisons between the two. We know that the R-ALA is 'assumably' a lot stronger and effective through studies. However, and I know FONZ and macro gave a guess of 35-40%, it is still debatable as to how much R-ALA is equivalent to a full strength racemic mixture. Once we get a better understanding of what this is, we can more accurately determine price advantages and disadvantages. Hopefully that made sense, and hopefully these percentages are even lower than the 2 given by FONZ and macro.

I will say that I commend AF for giving the public the chance to experiment and try the R-ALA. I predict the price is not all that bad either ($19.95/bottle) if it really is as strong as the studies claim it to be. I'll probably try it out and compare it in the future as I have been experimenting with this stuff for the last few years and have a pretty good sense of the racemic strengths.

The unhonosty of companies not putting the full ratio of the R & S-ALA is definately something that is up for grabs and a gamble as a consumer. This really blows, but I guess this is the case with all companies...you just never know 100%. The ones that stick around and continue selling certain products is a sign that it is a good buy, otherwise people wouldn't waste their money on crap.....ala HMB. BTW, i don't really question AF's quality, but as a consumer, we have to think this way. I'm sure the R-ALA will take off and be a great product, i'm as excited as anyone.

I just can't comment on the negating effects at this time as there just isn't enough info to really give an opinion on. Most people confuse the Biotin scenario though. ALA doesn't necessarily effect Biotin directly, but rather it competes for binding with biotin dependant enzymes in the liver that are responsible for creating oxaloacetate for gluconeogenesis and catalyzing leucine into acetoacetate and acetyl CoA. Therefore, there isn't really a biotin deficience per say, but rather a lowering of carboxylate enzymes available in the liver that bind with biotin.

For some reason, I don't think I needed to type this last paragraph...lol.

I wonder, and maybe MS, macro, cockdezl or anyone can correct me if i'm wrong, but if the S-ALA induces higher insulin levels, then this would actually help in lowering blood glucose levels furthermore. While the R-ala has a better GLUT-4 increase on the cell's surfaces, and therefore a higher percentage of glucose uptake, the insulin increased by the s-ala will assist in driving this glucose in synergistically?

btw...NICE SEEING YA!
BMJ

 

[Ulter]

I get around when I have something to say. I will leave the "very technical" stuff to those more suited to comment.

 

[MR. BMJ]

FONZ mentioned on the diet board that he was gonna start out at 700mg's per day. I believe he weighs about 125 pounds...

lol

just joking FONZ!

No, I think he is between the 180-200lb range if I remember correctly. Ultimately everyone is different since you can't necessarily compare one persons insulin sensitivity levels to another. On the AF board, Ulter mentioned that MACRO believes that you only need 35% of the dosage you were taking for the racemic mixture and FONZ said 40%. Hopefully it is less than this, as it will make the bottle last longer and be more cost effective. This is all speculation based off of the studies we have. Basically, like the racemic mixture of the S and R-ALA, we will probably have to go on personal experimentation for awhile until more is known. However, like I said, you can try out the percentages that both gave and see if it is a good starting point from there...just add or subtract if needed.

BMJ

BTW...I don't have a clue as to a good starting point. I could probably give a good guess, but haven't done the math necessary from the studies.

 

[Ulter]

300mg

I may be the first American to use r-ALA who wasn't a diabetic. As Marco pointed out to me, none of these studies were done on healthy people. I have only used it two days but there are two distinct differences, the first was that I didn't get heartburn from it. The second thing was that after only 300mg before a meal of 120gr of hi Gi carbs in about 2 hours I was weak and shakey like I hadn't eaten. Now I have had this feeling before from ALA but it was with 2000mg of the racemic.