Do you think musical talent will ever outweigh marketing again?

[Delinquent]

Seems that in this day of MTV'ism, the music industry will pick up anyone who they think will make them money regardless of their musical talent.

Rock that is played now is not what I consider rock. It's what we called alternative back in the early 90's. The lack of originality and musical talent has almost completely turned me off of listening to "rock" stations

Hip/hop is dead to me with the exception of the underground but we're talking about mainstream right now. This ho's and blingin shit is not how hip/hop came to be such a powerful force. It was poetry with a beat that explained life's issues. Now it's about how much money they flash and material items.

I don't listen to country at all but the few songs that I have heard sound more like southern rock with violin's than country music. Again, this seems to be a product of marketing rather than evolution of the industry.

Pop will always be the whore of the industry so there's not much I can say about that.

It's also not that I'm getting older as I like all older music up until the mid to late 90's. Everything just sounds the same now.

I doubt there is even a band that could sell out a stadium by themselves like they used to.

So, what is everyone opinion on this and what would be a possible remedy besides blowing up MTV

 

[Flah]

When has musical talent ever outweighed marketing?

 

[Delinquent]

Good point. I should reiterate and say when will musical talent play an integral role in determining whether the "artist" is signed.

I know it's all about money but I'd like to think that the record companies also enjoyed releasing good music that would make money not release talentless unoriginal garbage that they know will also make money.

 

[perkele]

Video killed the radio star.

 

[Flah]

Good point. I should reiterate and say when will musical talent play an integral role in determining whether the "artist" is signed.

I know it's all about money but I'd like to think that the record companies also enjoyed releasing good music that would make money not release talentless unoriginal garbage that they know will also make money.

Depends where you're looking. The only thing that concerns majors is the bottom line, since music is business and that's pretty much it. One of the label heads, forget which, said, "I know what good music is, I just don't want to record it." Same dude said, "I'd rather lose a million on a crossover album than make ten thousand with a good classical album."

I think what you're looking for is already in place with a lot of indies that care about their final product because they're looking for different things in the end like respect, admiration, etc. I mean, it'd be hard to say labels like Dischord and SST were only out there for a buck. Of course, they're marketing this stuff to a niche audience so it's easier for them to sign bands that are more experimental. Works in reverse too, you're not going to have any truly big sellers. There's a reason that most indies tank after a few years and can only put out a handful of records in their lifetime.

I guess it comes down to what you think has talent as well. I think it takes a lot of effort on someone’s part to sell millions of records. It doesn't just happen. There has to be something there. I think we sometimes confuse being experimental and pushing the boundaries with talent. That stuff is a hard sell, but it's always been like that. I don't think we're in an era where dumb awful crap sells more than any other era. I just think it's different dumb awful crap. I mean, look how long Bach's worked got passed over. And that's Bach, haha.

 

[Delinquent]

So what's missing then? Is it the same old cliche about getting older and not liking the new music? Shit I'm only 27 lol

It just seems that the music coming out lacks depth and originality. Has music started to reach its peak in terms of creativity? I know some have said that everything than can be done on the guitar has been done so maybe rock really is dead. There just seems to be something missing in the rock of today that I can't figure out.

Is the reason noone can sell out stadiums because there are so many different genres that are so popular at the same time? Or maybe people are more openminded about listening to multiple genres of music?

 

[Flah]

I think it all comes down to what you're listening to and where you're hearing it. Everything looks pretty blah on the surface, but if you do some digging, you'll find your diamonds.

I think there's a lot of stuff coming out even in the mainstream that has depth and originality to it. I mean, I don't know a whole lot about rap/hip hop. On the MC side, it kind of seems like there's before Rakim and after Rakim. Same kind of goes for production, there was before Timbaland and after Timbaland. A lot of stuff wants to follow that lead because it's proven. Just working and reworking a formula that sells. But, grime and hyphy are fairly new genres that are mining new ground. Below that, check out how Dalek and The Octopus are pushing production foward by taking the ideas of Thomas Köner and other ambient/noise/soundscape guys and applying it to rap. This is stuff is out there, it's just that the mainstream isn't ready for it yet, so it recieves limited coverage.

I don't think music will ever peak when it comes to creativity. Someone is always going to come around and throw us a curveball. I certainly don't think rock is dead either. Look at metal, it's a whole subculture where half of the population lives and breathes experimentation. Look at prog, look at the avant-garde. Same deals. Anyone that says that jazz is just eating its tail is missing Anthony Braxton cutting improvisational pieces with a stand up comedian or Dave Douglas doing god knows what now.

As far as the guitar, people are still working it. For every person that's content to play power chords, there's a Kevin Drumm that's dragging a chain across a steel guitar. For every person that wants to sound like Jimmy Page, there's a Debashish Bhattacharya who's adapting the slide guitar for indian classical music. If they're still around, there's going to be someone that's going to find a new way to screw with them.

Is mainstream rock dead? Eh, can't give you an objective answer. I think once something reaches the mainstream and there's a "craze" its already reached its saturation point. Once MTV starts touting it, it's time to look some place else, haha. The mainstream press can't find the pulse of the underground for whatever reason. When they finally get it, they mess it up through clueless branding and marketing. I mean, look at what happened to emo. The seperation between what I think is emo and what MTV thinks is emo is ridiculous. Basically short noisy, chaotic blasts of aggression vs. rebranded pop punk. Orchid vs. Weezer. But that's my mini rant.

 

[perkele]

I think it all comes down to what you're listening to and where you're hearing it. Everything looks pretty blah on the surface, but if you do some digging, you'll find your diamonds.

I think there's a lot of stuff coming out even in the mainstream that has depth and originality to it. I mean, I don't know a whole lot about rap/hip hop. On the MC side, it kind of seems like there's before Rakim and after Rakim. Same kind of goes for production, there was before Timbaland and after Timbaland. A lot of stuff wants to follow that lead because it's proven. Just working and reworking a formula that sells. But, grime and hyphy are fairly new genres that are mining new ground. Below that, check out how Dalek and The Octopus are pushing production foward by taking the ideas of Thomas Köner and other ambient/noise/soundscape guys and applying it to rap. This is stuff is out there, it's just that the mainstream isn't ready for it yet, so it recieves limited coverage.

I don't think music will ever peak when it comes to creativity. Someone is always going to come around and throw us a curveball. I certainly don't think rock is dead either. Look at metal, it's a whole subculture where half of the population lives and breathes experimentation. Look at prog, look at the avant-garde. Same deals. Anyone that says that jazz is just eating its tail is missing Anthony Braxton cutting improvisational pieces with a stand up comedian or Dave Douglas doing god knows what now.

As far as the guitar, people are still working it. For every person that's content to play power chords, there's a Kevin Drumm that's dragging a chain across a steel guitar. For every person that wants to sound like Jimmy Page, there's a Debashish Bhattacharya who's adapting the slide guitar for indian classical music. If they're still around, there's going to be someone that's going to find a new way to screw with them.

Is mainstream rock dead? Eh, can't give you an objective answer. I think once something reaches the mainstream and there's a "craze" its already reached its saturation point. Once MTV starts touting it, it's time to look some place else, haha. The mainstream press can't find the pulse of the underground for whatever reason. When they finally get it, they mess it up through clueless branding and marketing. I mean, look at what happened to emo. The seperation between what I think is emo and what MTV thinks is emo is ridiculous. Basically short noisy, chaotic blasts of aggression vs. rebranded pop punk. Orchid vs. Weezer. But that's my mini rant.

Rolling Stone mag should hire you.

 

[Flah]

I don't know crap about crud yet, still trying to navigate my way through the music world. Look how long it took me to accept pop music on its own merits. Remember those arguments we used to have? Haha, jesus.

 

[markshark]

Good point. I should reiterate and say when will musical talent play an integral role in determining whether the "artist" is signed.

I know it's all about money but I'd like to think that the record companies also enjoyed releasing good music that would make money not release talentless unoriginal garbage that they know will also make money.

sometimes talent is looked at but most of the time if a band or musician truly has talent big companies will sign them and water them down like crazy to be pop-friendly.