Wake Up People - Prohormones Dont Work

[the nature boy]

bump, me too.

 

[gtaman]

Prohormones - all I can reflect on is my experience.

Heavy doses of prohormones gained me 1-2 lbs.

One cycle of dbol at 50 mg for 3 weeks got me close to 10 lbs of permanent muscle gain.

Second cycle (sus/dbol/eq) I seem to have added around 10 more lbs lean muscle, hard to tell as I have also dropped fat while on this cycle, should end up around 10-11% bf.

Bottom line is with prohormones you will not exceed your natural limits by any significant margin. Yes you can gain but you would gain with food and creatine too.

With steroids the sky is the limit.

For all the good prohormones do, you might as well go buy some extra eggs and chicken, or invest in a comfortable mattress.

 

[eden]

so in some cases, 19nor4diol can also cause unnatural production of estrogen and DHT and cause gyno and MPB, is it correct? like through indirect route (free radicals or other factors...)???

 

[eden]

you got permanent gains from the dbol? how did u manage to do that? I tot ppl lose most gains from dbol~!?

 

[RealDeal]

elijah --> Re: Real deal

Gee thats right iq and experience is obviously based only on the number of posts I have. Silly me for forgetting. It was late and didn't feel like finding a link figured most people would know what I"m talking about but here ya go buddy!

Apperantly you haven't read to much about the nor products...

First, I was NOT referring to you elijah. Your post directly above mine was on the mark. I was, however, referring to The_Hulk_Jr who started this post. Sorry, I should've quoted his thoughtless comment to prevent any confusion. I do not associate # of posts with IQ or experience. There are guys on here with a low # of posts who really know their stuff.

Secondly, I have indeed read up on PH, but I excuse your assumptions since you thought I was flaming you rather than Hulkboy.

 

[CONTRACTION]

I can't deny that in the past I got definite strength gains from prohormones, but nothing changed in my physique. I have always had a great diet and workout plan and my wife who is a personal trainer guides me. Zip nada. Well, that was long ago...nothing like the real deal though

 

[Big Cat HH]

Try using them right ...

Well, I for one can't complain. I gained 16 pounds on my last cycle, 9 retained, I'd say that's pretty close to what steroids can give.

As for the guy saying he got permanent gains from d-bol, he lies. No way, anybody who knows steroids can tell you that.

I'd have to agree that to say prohormones as a whole suck and don't work is a bold statement, one I will gladly misprove if you spend 8 weeks with me and let me put you on a good stack. There are the bad apples like andro, 19Nor and 5AD, but the rest gives fairly good results, provided you know how to use them.

I get frequent mails from people saying "I only gained two pounds, what gives ?" Then I ask them what they took and its usually like 300 mg of a single product a day. So I tell them that a moderate dose is 600 mg total and for serious gains you are looking at 900-1200 mg. Then they tell me they can't affort that because they have to buy vanadyl or methoxy. Well duh. If you stopped wasting your money on crap and for once in your life did a decent cycle with decent doses you might see some of the capabilities of these products.

 

[elijah]

Doh gotta hate randomness :0

Hey realdeal my sincere apologies, I read your comment, then noticed I had 15 posts and assumed a bit much. I thought your refrence was to the fact I used pretty sloppy terms when responding to George's athletes failing a drug test. Again, sorry for flaming you with out reading a bit more carefully

 

[Par Deus]

so in some cases, 19nor4diol can also cause unnatural production of estrogen and DHT and cause gyno and MPB, is it correct? like through indirect route (free radicals or other factors...)???

I don't believe the 19-Nor-diol has any significant conversion to estrogen (though, the "dione" certainly does) -- it actually should lower estrogen by supressing testosterone. It also does not convert to DHT, and should lower it as well.

 

[Big Cat HH]

Nor-diol by itself has no estrogen conversion and does not stimulate androgen receptors. In terms of the target hormone nandrolone estrogenic conversion is slightly lower, but not mentionably so than that of testosterone, so expect some water retention.

For androgenic side-effects to occur doses would have to upward of 1 gram because Nandrolone is only 1/5th as androgenic as testosterone.

But yes, all side-effects that can occur off other prohormones can occur off Nor-diol if taken in a high enough dose.