P Seven

[Millie]

I have been following this thread with great interest and I am 99% sold on trying P7. I will be starting to cut in about 3-4 weeks and from previous experience I know that during cutting I definitely need something to help me with my mood, libido and thyroid. So P7 sounds like the perfect supplement for me

I just have a few questions. I read in the other P7 thread on the anabolic board, that it takes some time before the thyroid effects are felt. So, does this mean that it's a good idea to start taking P7 when you start the cutting cycle, so that by the time your metabolism slows down from dieting, the P7 will have started working?
Also, are there any negative hormonal side effects? Maybe this is a silly question, but I just want to be sure that I won't grow a moustache and a beard or have increased estrogen levels or anything else negative like that

Are there any know interactions between the ingredients in P7 and Wellbutrin?

And last question for now (I'm sure I will come up with more later )... you can ship this to Canada, right?

 

[valerie]

I got mine yesterday, it must be the womens formula, as it smells orangey and has a pic of oranges-I'll post on my experiences. Thanks AF-valerie

 

[Fonz]

Posted by fawnmarie:

2. Fonz is probably not noticing anything because he is a healthy YOUNG man who is producing enough pregn. of his own. Early testing of pregn. was done on young men, and found it didn't do much of anything and so research was dropped. Later studies showed that older and ill persons did, however, benefit from pregnenolone.

That is a very interesting assertion. This in reference of the fact that i din't get the calming effect.

But what about at night w/melatonin(6mg)?

Does pregnelonone(It is a hormone) levels decrease at night...if this is the case, then it should readily explain why it puts me ina deep sleep quickly.

I have time today, so I'll try to research it.

MY bet right now is, that pregnenolone levels do decrease at night. Pregnenolone is a pre-cursor to DHEA,estradiol, and testerone. And test levels are lowest at night(highest in the AM), So, extrapolating from this pregnenolone levels ahould be also be low at night.(All theoretical right now)

Fonz

The culprit of a persons oily skin on P7 is pregnenolone.

Why?

Because the chemical structure of the 6-oxo-DHEA does not
aromatize.

BUT, pregenolone converts to DHEA then to test/estrogen.

Therefore the pregnenolone raises test/estrogen/DHEA levels minimally.

BUT, comnining the three, you get acne.

If you could come up with a non-aromatizable pregnenolone, then you have a winner.

Both hormones are non-aromatizable to their smaller compounds.

Fonz

 

[Michael Corleone 21]

so does this mean that it would be a bad idea for me to buy this product?? I have a history of having a high test to estrogen conversion....would the pregnolone in this product make things worse for me???

 

[macrophage69alpha]

so does this mean that it would be a bad idea for me to buy this product?? I have a history of having a high test to estrogen conversion....would the pregnolone in this product make things worse for me???

as per PM.. unlikely.. due to enzymatic competition.. it actually may lower estro levels..

 

[macrophage69alpha]

btw- if you have high estro levels you should be running low dose aromatase inhibitor ALL THE TIME..

 

[fawnmarie]

Well... I had just ordered some Yohimburn and received a sample of the orange P7 in the package - Thanks Guys!

It must work, because my S.O. is still alive this morning...

As for the acne - I have very often heard of women breaking out on plain 'ol DHEA - very often. After Macro's clarification, I did look up the 7-oxo-dhea and apparently it doesn't convert to any androgens at all. On the other hand, I've NEVER heard of anyone breaking out on pregnenolone and have discussed it's use with many people. It might be as Macro says - due to increased thyroid function. I've never had any skin problem with plain oral pregn.

Anyway - am still curious about the dosage per pipette of pregn. and would like to know.

DaisyGirl - Optimal pregn. dosage is age dependent. Most of Ray Peat recommendations are for chronically ill or menopausal/andropausal folks - not sure how they would convert to normal healthy people. He recommends 50mgs per day until improvement in symptoms are reached, and then titrate down. He says that pregnenolone is recycled in the body, so that one large dosage can be taken weekly and will remain effective. He also prescribes T-3 for his patience, and I'm sure that reduces the required dosage of pregn.

I myself use 30 mgs per day, three or four times a week. I am assuming that in my case it is converting to progesterone, rather than DHEA, since I don't have any more estrogen dominance symptoms and have stopped using progesterone for several months now. I don't use regular DHEA at all anymore, since I have never had much trouble making enough androgens, and if anything need to keep them under control. MIGHT be a mild case of late-onset adrenal dysplasia - though at this point in my life there's no reason to worry about it.

Fawn

PS - Almost forgot - I've used oral pregnenolone with wellbutrin and had no problems. I found wellbutrin to be good for obessessive compulsive behaviours, but useless for depression - the pregnenolone got rid of the depression.

 

[Millie]

thanks for your answer regadring my wellbutrin question. fawnmarie

macro or ulter, what are your thought on my question about the time it takes to affect thyroid activity?

and 2 more questions...

what about adding an oral 7-oxo-dhea supplementation, since this is what is causing the increase in thyroid activity?

and what is the reason you are including progesterone and dhea in the women's formula? would any of these ingredients, i.e. progesterone, dhea, pregnenolone have a negative effect on a cutting cycle, such as decreased ability to lower bf, increase in estrogenic fat etc?

more questions (sorry) ... i admit i am not very familiar with the hormonal mechanism of the body, so please bear with me if my questions seem stupid....
i just reread the whole thread and saw that in the women's formula pregnenolone will be of a lowered dose. what is the reason behind this? i mean isn't pregnenolone what is causing the mood elevation?

 

[macrophage69alpha]

what about adding an oral 7-oxo-dhea supplementation, since this is what is causing the increase in thyroid activity?

and what is the reason you are including progesterone and dhea in the women's formula?

dont add... you dont need more... very sure..

because it is a more balanced formulation with respect to womens endocrinology.. the 7-oxo competition with dhea should decrease any potential raise in E (still expect a drop, though less. will vary) and will allow for some increase in adrenal test production (from the user reports.. which are still very limited.. the combination is VERY good).. but still needs more time and feedback for widespread release and formula finalization (albeit dont really beleive in finalization.. there is always room for improvement.. add infinitum)

 

[macrophage69alpha]

what about adding an oral 7-oxo-dhea supplementation, since this is what is causing the increase in thyroid activity?

and what is the reason you are including progesterone and dhea in the women's formula?

dont add... you dont need more... very sure..

because it is a more balanced formulation with respect to womens endocrinology.. the 7-oxo competition with dhea should decrease any potential raise in E (still expect a drop, though less. will vary) and will allow for some increase in adrenal test production (from the user reports.. which are still very limited.. the combination is VERY good).. but still needs more time and feedback for widespread release and formula finalization (albeit dont really beleive in finalization.. there is always room for improvement.. ad infinitum)