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Weight loss, toning, and AS - need help

eric123

New member
Here are some basic stats:
1. 272 lbs.
2. 28% BF
3. History of 2 mass cycles (both with poor results)
4. 30 years old
5. Working out for 15 years (off and on - mostly on)

My dilema is this: I would like to drop bodyfat, increase strength, and increase my lean muscle mass. My two previoius cycles both involved heavy doses of test/dbol/deca. My last cycle put an unwelcome 20+ pounds on me (mostly in my stomach), but increased my overall strength dramatically. I have been off for 7+ months, and am ready to get started on an effective AS program again (need to get toned/shaped up for summer).

My questionis this: What would be a good cycle recomendation to help lose weight, increase strength, and build lean muscle mass? I have very little success training naturally, and have great difficulty losing weight in my stomach area (so please avoid comments to do nothing but more cardio). Admittedly, my diet consists of heavy calories, and I just recently started doing cardio more frequently.

I was considering deca/winny... or maybe deca/winny/clen... or maybe just winny. I truly desire the cutting effect that (I hear) winstrol produces, so I'd like to include it, if possible. Also, where can I get specific info on proper dieting (which would include actual grocery items to purchase)?

Thank you in advance.
 
uummm...I don't think you should be considering any more AS. You may want to focus on your diet and your training first. If you have been lifting for 15 years and still haven't figured out the best forumla for weightloss for yourself, consult a personal trainer or someone who may help. These boards are an excellent place to start.



Gear should not even be in the equation at the moment:)
 
I appreciate the response, and your point is well taken. Perhaps I seek to cheat the system a little, and put my body on the fast- track to "chisel-dom." However, the point I sought to stress is that I posess little hope in my effort to slim down naturally, and quite frankly, I'm a bit unconcerned about my actual weight - just want to lose the belly.

My legs look incredible, muscles are large and somewhat firm. My arms are huge -19.5 inches (the word "huge" being used humbly, not trying to compare myself to a bodybuilder, just an average man). My lats are ok. My chest is decent in size, but has no real tone. All my weight seems to congregate in my stomach, and I bloat EASILY... the last time I took Dbol, I bloated so much I could barely get out of my chair, waddled when I walked, and split several pairs of pants. But the strength gains were outstanding... put 75 pounds on my bench in about 4 weeks or so.

Would it be prudent to take some prescription medication for weightloss, such as phentermine or the like? Should this be my first priority? I took phen-phen a long time ago, and it worked extremely well for me.

Obviously it wuz stupid for me to take dbol/deca/test... when I should have been cutting, but I'm keenly interested in strength gains. How about fina? Or clen?
 
I'm going to have to agree with guards. 28% seems to be really high to be considering any type of bulking cycle.

Unless there is a medical condition preventing you from losing weight (in which case a doctor should be prescribing medication), I suggest a CKD, lots of cardio, and a mild fat burner, something with a green tea extract. I don't know a single person, who having tried and stayed with similar diet programs, have not lost weight.

Of course, the best way to lose weight is to expend more calories than your taking in, and vice versa. Thus, cutting and bulking cycles will work much more effectively than trying to do both at the same time. Good luck.
 
Thank you two for the responses... I will seek the assistance of a personal trainer and get on a proper diet plan.

I suppose it's unrealistic to obtain strength gains without some sort of mass/weight increasing cycle. I was just under the impression that winny was some sort of "magic pill" that cut you up (shred excess fat) and increased strength (when used with heavy training and high protein dieting). I naturally wouldn't expect the strength gains from winstrol to match that of dbol of course, but I'm curious to see how my body responds to it.

I'll just get with a trainer at my gym, eat better, do cardio... and maybe wait a month before starting a cycle. But, I really want to look good this summer though, and know that - if left to my own resources, this goal will not be met.
 
eric123 said:
Thank you two for the responses... I will seek the assistance of a personal trainer and get on a proper diet plan.

I suppose it's unrealistic to obtain strength gains without some sort of mass/weight increasing cycle. I was just under the impression that winny was some sort of "magic pill" that cut you up (shred excess fat) and increased strength (when used with heavy training and high protein dieting). I naturally wouldn't expect the strength gains from winstrol to match that of dbol of course, but I'm curious to see how my body responds to it.

I'll just get with a trainer at my gym, eat better, do cardio... and maybe wait a month before starting a cycle. But, I really want to look good this summer though, and know that - if left to my own resources, this goal will not be met.

Dude, you are already starting with a defeatist attitude. You can certainly obtain the goals you have set out, you just have to be determined. There is absolutely no reason why you couldn't biologically obtain them.

Surf these boards for a good diet, follow it stricly, and than find a realiable training split. The old fasioned one bodypart a day, once a week, is an excellent base.


One month may not be enough for you to ready yourself for another cutting cycle. Get your shit down, drop some pounds, and than think about it.

If there is anything i can do help, don't hesitate to ask.:)
 
I'm keenly interested in learning about various dieting programs, yet am uncertain where one might obtain such information without spending hundreds of dollars (consulting with a bodybuilder).

I don't have time for massive amounts of surfing to find this info, and often notice that our nutrition board here mostly operates as a recipe exchange. I need an entire eating program... one which outlines exactly which groceries to buy and what not (cause I'm a sucky and uninventive cook).

Guards, I will take the advice.... however, do you feel that clen or something similiar would help me reach my goals faster at some future point? Clen does't really count as "juice" does it (since it produces no muscle gain)? Isn't Clen quite similiar to an ECA stack in that it's a thermogenic fatburner (raising body temperature) and causes nervousness and occasional hyperactivity? I seem to remember reading posts on this forum over a year ago about people using clen and dropping 10 pounds per week... sweating so much in their sleep that they slept with a towel under them..........

I just know that "mentally," when I'm on, I seen to be more motivated to work out harder and eat better (as opposed to lazily sitting around eating chips & cookies in front of the TV).
 
well bro i'm in your same postion, kinda. My first cycle was deca200 and i didn't know my ass from my elbow about AS and i just listened to this one kid, who i though new his shit when it came to AS, but when it came down to it he knew about as much as me. He said eat anything and everything so i did, i ate pizza and well you know the rest.

right now my stats are 5'11 215lbs 20% BF, before i started i was 172lbs 12% BF, i had a 32in waist and now i have a 38in waist. My fat is mostly around my stomach, everyother part on my body is lean.

I just finished up my first 10 weeks of my cycle and now i have 5 more weeks left, here is my cycle:

1-10 Enan 500mg/wk
1-10 EQ 400mg/wk
10-15 Prop 100mg/ed
10-15 Tren 75mg/ed
10-15 Winny 50mg/ed

i used clen/t3 during the first part of the 10 weeks and i didn't really like it, so now i'm going back to what has worked for me time and time again, Xenadrine.


I've taken xenadrine twice now, before i even started training i was a FAT 238lbs probably 30%bf and i took xenadrine for two 12 week cycles and got all the way down to 172lbs and that's when i started AS(and then got fat again,b/c of my diet and lack of knowledge :( )

so i would recommend you go with xenadrine till you get down to about 13% bf and then start up, you will be much happier with the results. And when you decide to start up stay away from the deca, i've read it tends to hold more fat on you than say EQ(which hits the same receptors).


When your on the xenadrine just stay away from pizza and all that other crap and cut out the soft drinks and you will be fine, btw i didn't even do cardio when i lost all that weight, but i recommend doing at least 20min on the X-Trainer.


GOOD LUCK BRO!!!!!!!

please feel free to PM for any other questions you have....
 
I've not done any research on Xenadrine... yet I certainly will do so now... especially in light of hearing about your success with it. Wow.. that's an amazing weight drop.

It's difficult to internalize the concept that my body is unprepared for a cycle that would produce real noticable differences in my appearance... especially considering "beach" season is quickly approaching... and I really wanted to avoid another summer in which I was embarrassed to remove my shirt in front of bikini-clad women.

However, I think now it would be to my advantage to invest what money I normally would spend on gear into a personal trainer and dietician.

Oh and by the way CrazyC, I too was misinformed about eating habits while on deca... was told to "eat everything in sight - otherwise you won't make gains." This advice (I found out thru personal experience) is preposterous to someone who already is heavy-set (thick boned...), and prone to sloppy eating habits. I suppose if you're a little 180 lb. guy trying to put on size, then juicing and eating at Ryans (all-you-can-eat buffets) is ok... but not for our body types.
 
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