AS before hitting your natural potential: mess up future natural gains?

[Peyomp]

I realize that ideally, you should build up your musculature until it is at its natural peak, and then consider doing AS. Well call me young and foolish, but I'm 22... and I don't wanna wait. If you've been working out for 3-4 months, and you read the boards, and learn how to use properly... and your nutrition is good, and you work out intensely but do not overtrain... why shouldn't you do AS?

I want the gains faster than I'm getting them. I'm willing to put in the work. No, its not ideal, but I don't exactly see a huge difference between a relatively weak guy wanting to put on some weight and a big guy wanting to put on some weight. Most big guys did not maximize their potential before they started using (or am I wrong?).

So my question is...

if you start using AS early, does it affect you differently than if you use later? I mean I don't have a huge amount of upper body muscle mass, but my muscles are used to being worked. I wail on them till it hurts like hell, I go till failure, and I do it over and over again.

I keep hearing from some people that:

1) If you use AS before you reach your natural potential, you will not see good gains.

2) If you use AS before you reach your natural potential, your gains will disappear afterwards (Does this assume you don't continue training hard?)

3) If you use AS before you reach your natural potential, you will damage your body's ability to grow naturally.

Which are true? Why?

To get specific, we're talking about a cycle of test here. I think I can take it, gain alot of mass, get off it, keep working out, and continue to grow at a normal pace (assuming the right level of intensity for the new muscle...). Am I wrong?

Lots of this has been commented on before, but not in detail. Or rather, I can't find posts on this where people back up what they're saying.

 

[The Almighty]

If you have only been lifting for 3-4 months than you are wasting your money using A.S.

First, you cant possibly know how to diet and train correctly in 3-4 months. You cant read about your body inparticular and what works and doesnt for it. This knowledge comes from years of both research and experience.

Also, you make the best gains your first 6 months of working out, A.S. wont increase the rate at which they come. Dont waste your money dude, stay natural for at least a few years.

 

[Peyomp]

If you have only been lifting for 3-4 months than you are wasting your money using A.S.

First, you cant possibly know how to diet and train correctly in 3-4 months. You cant read about your body inparticular and what works and doesnt for it. This knowledge comes from years of both research and experience.

Also, you make the best gains your first 6 months of working out, A.S. wont increase the rate at which they come. Dont waste your money dude, stay natural for at least a few years.

I don't get this. I eat a gram of protein per gram of body fat a day, spread out over 5-6 meals. I eat wholesome natural foods. Thats good nutrition. Got that covered.

I read Arnold's book, and I study myself in the mirror as I do an exercise... I do them as suggested. I have a trainer friend that gives me tips. I have good form. I mix up my exercises.

I think test would make me blow up with muscle mass. Why wouldn't it?

 

[Willyumyum]

I think it will become harder to gain both on AND off of gear, due to the fact that you are reaching/getting close to and/or passing your genetic potential... Gains will naturally slow, and therefore you may get the impression that gains have been reduced due to premature AS usage or whatever, when all it really is is you getting swole as shit and in turn it becomes harder and harder to make significant gains..

YUM

 

[Peyomp]

I think it will become harder to gain both on AND off of gear, due to the fact that you are reaching/getting close to and/or passing your genetic potential... Gains will naturally slow, and therefore you may get the impression that gains have been reduced due to premature AS usage or whatever, when all it really is is you getting swole as shit and in turn it becomes harder and harder to make significant gains..

YUM

This makes sense. So in reality, you haven't sabotaged yourself... you've just pushed yourself quickly to your natural limits on a cycle of AS, and so after that you're working against your genetics with natural training...

This makes sense to me.

 

[The Almighty]

I don't get this. I eat a gram of protein per gram of body fat a day, spread out over 5-6 meals. I eat wholesome natural foods. Thats good nutrition. Got that covered.

I read Arnold's book, and I study myself in the mirror as I do an exercise... I do them as suggested. I have a trainer friend that gives me tips. I have good form. I mix up my exercises.

I think test would make me blow up with muscle mass. Why wouldn't it?

Diet is not only about how much protein you eat. It is about the exact ratio of protein/carbs/fat that works best for you individually. The gains you make now naturally will be better and more solid than the gains you make from using gear at this point in your training.
Just trust me on this one when I say it is a bad idea. Im sure all of the other replies will agree with me. You seem very impatient and I can understand that especially when it comes to changing your body to lok the way you want it, but give yourself some time dude.

 

[Willyumyum]

This makes sense. So in reality, you haven't sabotaged yourself... you've just pushed yourself quickly to your natural limits on a cycle of AS, and so after that you're working against your genetics with natural training...

This makes sense to me.

Yes

YUM

 

[Peyomp]

Diet is not only about how much protein you eat. It is about the exact ratio of protein/carbs/fat that works best for you individually. The gains you make now naturally will be better and more solid than the gains you make from using gear at this point in your training.
Just trust me on this one when I say it is a bad idea. Im sure all of the other replies will agree with me. You seem very impatient and I can understand that especially when it comes to changing your body to lok the way you want it, but give yourself some time dude.

Hypothetical:

So you're saying that if I put on 30 pounds of muscle in 16 weeks on test, then keep that muscle on with rigorous training, for say 6 months...

I will not have as "good" muscle as if I'd just built up my muscle mass to the same levels naturally over 6 months?

Is this a tendon/connective tissue/vascularity thing? Slower means more time for the support systems to catch up?

 

[HansNZ]

OK, here's my advice:

Eating enough protein is fine, but if your overall calories aren't high enough you won't grow. I learned that the hard way. Whatever you're eating, it's probably not enough - especially if you're a slow gainer and an ectomorph.

When you're 22 you're impatient. It comes with the territory. There's no point in people saying "train for a few years" until you reach natural limits, etc, etc. We all know that you're gonna juice before that. In any case 22 or 23 is not too young to juice. If you were 16 that would be different.

What I suggest is a compromise. Train naturally for a year. You are going to gain fast in your first year. You might not think you're gaining fast - but you are. After year one you have to get smart with training and nutrition to get the same results. You are too new to training to understand your body yet. You think you do, but we all think we know what we're doing otherwise we'd be doing whatever "it" is differently.

Experiment a bit with some supplements like creatine ALA, etc in this year. Build up your stocks of steroids, anti-estrogens, etc. Get a variety of things and make sure you have everything you need for your first cycle. Plan your cycle carefully. Try something mild at first like primo/oxandrolone. See how your body responds.

I doubt juicing now is going to cause irreparable damage of the type you quoted in your thread. What you do have to realise is that when you start juicing it is a one-way street. After using steroids natural training won't satisfy, and I doubt your body will respond to it as much as before for a long time after you have discontinued steroids. You will need the steroids until you reach your goal. You will also need to cycle periodically from that time on to maintain your gains.

Best of luck.

 

[Diesel3d]

I agree , diet is a hard thing to learn. I admit, I jumped into AS thinking i knew about dieting too, but I did not. I started too early. I made ok gains off my first cycle, but only because it was my first. My second i got very poor results, and that's when it hit me.... It was all my diet. I'm on my 3rd cycle now and have gained almost 20 pounds in 4 1/2 weeks because I have finally understood dieting after experimenting naturally before this cycle.

It's so much more than just getting 1 gram per pound of body weight. You got to understand bulking and cutting diets... you must understand where different types of fat protein and carbs have their place at specific times of the day, for specific diets. You also need to learn your metabolism... A lot of other things too, but the best way to find this out is to experiment with yourself to see what works.

I don’t regret my early cycles, maybe just my second one.. but my advice to you now is to get your diet down and see what works best for you naturally before you take anything.