8w cutting/LBM cycle (Prop/Tren/Win/Ana/Clen) - Advice/thoughts?

[MrChisel]

This is my first post, but I have been an avid reader of the forum for quite some time. I might have made some spelling/language errors (not a native English speaker), or broken some obscure rule... If so: Let the flaming begin


Anyway, here goes...

My stats:

26yrs
4th cycle (1st: Deca/Susta, 2nd: Prop/Win/Ana/Clen, 3rd: Clen/Ana)
181cm (5' 9''+)
~80kg (~175 pounds)
Been doing Muay Thai boxing for 10 years, combined with a fairly serious lifting regime (3 yrs) and swimming as recreation/cardio (for the last 6 months)

Planned gear:
Anavar (Oral tabs)
Testo Propionate (Inject)
Stanozolol (Winstrol Inject)
Trenbolone Acetate (Inject)
Clenbuterol

Goals: Getting harder, ripped. Lean body mass increases. As little bloating as possible and preferably 5kg max weight increase (I am training muay thai boxing and therefore I can not gain too much weight, I'd rather stay on the same weight or at least <85-90kg and decrease in fat percentage)

8 weeks cycle.
Injections:
w. 1-8: T-prop 200mg EOD
w. 1-6: Tren A 50 mg ED
w. 2-8: Stanozolol 50mg ED

Oral:
w. 1-8: Clenbuterol 2w on/2w off (pyramid cycle)
w. 1-8: 40-80 mg Anavar ED (pyramid cycle)

I have no problem pinning every day, I actually almost prefer it over e5d or eod as it becomes part of the morning ritual and feels more routine.

PCT:
Tamoxifen 20mg 4weeks (is there any point in taking 40mg for the first week of PCT??)


...?

 

[MrChisel]

Noone?

 

[MrChisel]

I'd hate to spam but I am not sure how I should interpret the fact that noone is even responding to the thread? Not even a "sounds good" or a "that's a really stupid cycle", just nothing...

 

[Judo Tom]

too much gear. you are running an oral for too long.. you are stacking orals

i never understood crazy cycles especially for cutting.

what advantage does that very large dosed cycle really give you over a simple test cycle for cutting?

have you ever ran that much gear and tried to train? good luck.. very high chance you get injured very high chance the pumps are too much etc etc

if you train that much a simple test cycle with a good diet will let you cut up like a freak.

 

[MrChisel]

What do you mean stacking orals? I am only doing oxandrolone orally together with clen (which isn't really an aas)... And is 8 weeks too long even for a fairly "safe" aas such as Anavar?

Yes, I have been training on a similar cycle (trained for 6 weeks, 2 times a day, 6 days a week, on 200 mg T-Prop EOD, 75mg Stanozolol ED week 2-6, 80 mg Anavar ED, 120 mg Clen ED), and it worked just fine...

I will only be on Stanozolol for 6 weeks, thus starting week 3 (not 2 as stated above).

I am considering shortening the Tren to the first 5 weeks. Would that be a waste of gear?

 

[conundrum]

too much gear. you are running an oral for too long.. you are stacking orals

i never understood crazy cycles especially for cutting.

what advantage does that very large dosed cycle really give you over a simple test cycle for cutting?

have you ever ran that much gear and tried to train? good luck.. very high chance you get injured very high chance the pumps are too much etc etc

if you train that much a simple test cycle with a good diet will let you cut up like a freak.

I would have to agree...

 

[MrChisel]

Perhaps I have to make some clarifications:

Firstly, I will be spending two months focusing entirely on this (i.e. I will have no work/school or other obligations other than just training, lifting, eating and sleeping).

Secondly, I will not fully be able to control the diet/food intake, but I will be making sure that I eat as healthy as possible (mostly fruit, chicken, rice, potatoes).

As mentioned, I have tried this (or a similar setup) before for 6 weeks. I got good results.

Also, I reviewed my calculations of the gear I will have access to, and realized I'd made some errors. This is the correct cycle:

w1 will start by frontloading Testo Prop (200 EOD 4 times), and start the pyramid of Anavar 40 mg day 1, 50 mg day 2, 60 mg day 3, and 70 mg ED from day 4 and onward. I will also be starting the Clen cycle, starting with 40 mcg day 1, 80 mcg day 2 and 120 mcg from day 3 and onward (for the first 2 weeks)

w2 I will be lowering the Testo Prop to 175mg EOD, and I will be staying on the 70mg Anavar and Clen 120 mcg ED. From w2 I will be starting 40-50 mg Tren A ED

w3 Testo Prop 175mgEOD; Anavar 70 ED; Tren A 40-50 ED; Stanozolol 50mg ED

w4 Testo Prop 175mgEOD; Anavar 70 ED; Tren A 40-50 ED; Stanozolol 50mg ED

w5 Testo Prop 175mgEOD; Anavar 70 ED; Tren A 40-50 ED; Stanozolol 50mg ED, Clen 120mcg ED (starting 40-80-120)

w6 Testo Prop 175mgEOD; Anavar 70 ED; Tren A 40-50 ED; Stanozolol 50mg ED, Clen 120mcg ED

w7 I will be dropping the Tren A, and go only for Testo Prop 175mgEOD; Anavar 70 ED; Stanozolol 50mg ED, Clen 120mcg ED

w8 (final week) Testo Prop 175mgEOD; Anavar 70 ED; Stanozolol 50mg ED

Again, from what I understand being on Anavar for 8 weeks is not a problem, given the low side effects (and moderate doses I will be on)?

If people are interested I am more than happy to write a journal. I will be starting in the cycle in 2 months.

 

[Judo Tom]

ok the dedication is great but...

You really need to be able to control your diet like 95% if you diet is not 95% your results will really suffer

do not run winstrol and anavar at the same time.
do not run anavar for 8 weeks especially at that dosage.
do not run winstrol for over 4 weeks
lower your overall dosage that is a lot of juice for a 4th cycle.

 

[MrChisel]

ok the dedication is great but...

You really need to be able to control your diet like 95% if you diet is not 95% your results will really suffer

do not run winstrol and anavar at the same time.
do not run anavar for 8 weeks especially at that dosage.
do not run winstrol for over 4 weeks
lower your overall dosage that is a lot of juice for a 4th cycle.

Thanks for the input.

I was originally thinking of lowering the Tren to 75mg EOD, but since it appears like there is a higher risk of side effects if you pin Tren EOD vs. if you pin it ED (more stable levels with ED) I'm not sure...(?)

Let's say I lower the Testo Prop after the first fronloading week down to 150 EOD instead of 175 EOD.... And that I lay off the Anavar and start the Winstrol week 5, would that be sufficient or do you suggest that I lower the dosages even more? If so, how?

 

[Judo Tom]

that is definitely better but.. well first i am a low dose advocatei believe 99% of the non pros out there can get SICK / CRAZY gains staying under 750mg total dosage.. i know sounds crazy but I believe it and Ive seen it over and over again.. so now you at least know where im coming from.

2nd do you plan to train w/ that much juice in your system? have you ever tried a muay thai class w/ that much juice?

also you want to gain 5kg at 178? I guarantee 100% that you can accomplish that goal with 1/2 the juice you listed but you would have to change your diet and the total amount of cardio you do... now your cycle w/ all that gear may give you your 5kg easy.. it should.. but if you dont change your diet and cardio.. you wont keep it anyhow.. so why get juiced to the gills for a temporary increase?

look we might not agree.. thats cool id still like to help and just give another opinion on things..

oh and I HATE CLEN especially for athletes.. BOOOO CLEN

ok one last thing.. please read up on pct especially posts by nelson and steve.. PLEASE