Re: Hey PA- Could we continue our tribestan discussion please here sir?
Posted by PA on March 26, 1997 at 14:00:44:
In Reply to: Hey PA- Could we continue our tribestan discussion please here sir? posted by Another Jeff on March 26, 1997 at 12:03:56:
: I know the earlier part of our previous discussion is waaaaay down the page at the
: bottom just above the posting form so lets continue here. Rather than go into the
: hypothalamus/testicular axis and the reasons why I think tribestan increases spermatogenesis
: (increased GnRH results in increased LH, ABP, and testosterone?), I would very much
: like an honest critique about this article found on the net. In particular if you are
: familiar with the studies mentioned and the sponsors of those studies (Sopharm?).
: Thanks man- I value your opinion. Here is the article excerpt:
: ...Early studies using animals clearly demonstrated Tribestan's effects on some
: key reproductive functions. Among the findings in rats treated for 7-20 days
: with moderate-to-high oral doses were marked increases in spermatogenesis
: (sperm production) and improvements in the quality, motility and survival time
: of sperm. Studies on boars administered Tribestan at 70 mg per kilogram of
: bodyweight per day for 10 days demonstrated a dramatic recovery of libido
: and improved sexual reflex time, even in those animals with established
: prolonged impotence.
: The research of greatest interest to bodybuilders and other athletes are clinical
: studies conducted at the Chemical Pharmaceutical Institute. Tests on healthy
: men ages 28-45 demonstrated that three tablets (250 mg each) taken for just
: five days increased testosterone levels by a significant 30% or more (Milanov,
: Maleeva and Taskov, Sopharma documentation, 1981). That would help
: explain the popularity of the product with world-class Bulgarian athletes,
: especially before competition.
: The mechanism by which Tribestan produces this effect is believed to be
: through stimulation of the secretion of leutinizing hormone (LH, a
: gonad-stimulating hormone produced by the pituitary gland). The only catch in
: the study was that in some cases, an increase in the level of estradiol occurred
: as well. While it could enhance growth-hormone secretion and overall mass
: increases, this could bode poorly for those who are highly susceptible to
: gynecomastia (male development of female-type breast tissue) or insulin
: resistance. In women, follicle-stimulating hormone, but not LH, and estradiol,
: but not testosterone, were increased. This differential effect allows Tribestan
: to be effectively used by both sexes to stimulate reproductive function.
: Additional studies sponsored by the Chemical Pharmaceutical Institute were
: carried out on 212 males, ages 14-60, at three sites: the Higher Military
: Medical Institute, and the institutes of Endocrinology, Gerontology and
: Geriatrics, and Obstetrics and Gynecology at the Bulgarian Medical
: Academy. All individuals studied had reproductive disorders of some type,
: ranging from impotence to hypogonadism to infertility. Tribestan was
: administered in doses generally ranging from 750-1,500 mg per day for an
: average of 30-60 days.
: The results confirmed the previous work in that testosterone levels increased
: in many cases, as did libido, frequency and strength of erections and the
: sexual reflexes (recovery from sexual activity). Other positive changes
: observed in a number of cases were a reduction of cholesterol and positive
: psychological effects such as improved mood and increased self-confidence.
: No adverse effects were noted in any of the clinical studies, and additional
: research using animals demonstrated no adverse effects on the central nervous
: or cardiovascular systems. Administration of Tribestan had a mild diuretic
: effect in several cases in the human trials.
: Toxicity was found to be extremely low both in acute studies (the oral dose
: required to kill 50% of rats tested, the LD subscript 50, is more than 10
: grams per kilogram of bodyweight) and over extended periods (23 months at
: oral doses of up to 150 mg per kilogram of bodyweight per day). No known
: negative effects presently exist when Tribestan is used as a nutritional
: supplement or when used as adjunctive therapy (under a physician's guidance)
: in the absence of other prescribed medications.
: Right now, fewer than a handful of products in the U.S. contain any
: preparation of the Tribulus plant, but that's likely to change soon. Although
: m&f writer Mauro Di Pasquale, MD, rates Tribestan as questionable in his
: Bodybuilding Supplement Review based on the lack of significant scientific
: substantiation of any anabolic effects in athletes, I'm willing to go out on a limb
: on this one and suggest that it appears to have real potential for bodybuilders.
: Time will tell.
: SPECIFIC PHARMACOLOGICAL ACTIVITIES OF TRIBULUS
: MALES - Increases libido (sexual desire); improves strength of
: erection and spermatogenesis (formation and development of sperm);
: may increase the level of testosterone (a hormone secreted by the
: testes, the most potent natural anabolic-androgenic hormone).
: FEMALES - Increases libido; improves ovulation effect; decreases the
: vasomotor symptoms accompanying menopause; reduces apathy and
: Before joining muscle & fitness, Jim Wright, PhD, served as chief of the
: Exercise Science Branch, U.S. Army Fitness School. He also directed
: research in exercise physiology at the U.S. Army Research Institute of
: Environmental Medicine and has participated in many investigations of
: muscle physiology and performance. The author of more than 60
: professional publications, Wright consults for several federal and state
: agencies and athletic organizations, and serves as technical reviewer for
: professional journals. In the early '70s, he was a National Collegiate
: Powerlifting Champion.
: The above is an excerpt of an article. It mentions studies that prove elevated
: testosterone from oral tribestan doses. Please comment- THANKS.
If these results were so striking why didn't they publish them in a peer reviewed journal?
This reminds me of the mysterious Avena Sativa studies from the "Institute of Sexology" in Paris.
You got to learn to be very critical of these things especially when the results are "in house"
from some obscure institution.
If you want to be convinced by this that is your choice. And don't call me sir, to you its
all knowing, almighty god of anabolism and sexual deviancy. thanx
- Re: Hey PA- Could we continue our tribestan discussion please here sir? Unique 01:10:09 3/27/97
- Re: Thanks Unique Another Jeff 11:41:38 3/27/97
- Re: Thanks Unique Another Jeff 11:41:38 3/27/97 (0)
- Re: Hey PA- Could we continue our tribestan discussion please here sir? The TOWER 19:50:47 3/26/97
- Awww man, I cant call you that- I only call Duchaine that. Another Jeff 15:07:20 3/26/97