box squat height

[IrishPower]

Brian,

I just wanted to move this to a different thread because it is a good discussion point.

I am 5'9. I swear i used to be 5'10, but I think all the squatting has squashed me. I use a 12.5" box now. I was using a 13.5, but slowly worked my way down because i was not satisfied with my depth.

Finding the appropriate box height is tricky. It depends on a couple of factors.

1. your height.
2. your build and hip flexibility
3. your ham and glute strength
4. your stance

I think you have found like many others (myself included) that they were not able to sit back on the box properly with an ultra wide stance. I worked on it for a while, dropping the box height gradually, moving my stance in a little then re-widening as i got stronger, etc. By the way, it takes me like 20 minutes of warmups and at least 315 on the bar before i can get down to the box without plopping the last inch or so.

I have said this before, and it is not a measure of disrepect. The westside lifters go extremely wide and there are NOT many of them that can get their lifts passed in a tough-judging organization with their typical stance.

On one extreme is the USPF (which i think is far too strict and anal especially with the squat). I wouldn't try squatting in this organization even when I was younger and more flexible. The next level is probably APF/WPO, which has swung from easy judging (<1996), really hard judging (1996 - 1998), back to something more reasonable (present). I think that most westside guys would have to take their stance in and drop their squats weights by 100lbs to get passed here. Recent evidence is Chuck's bomb at the WPO meet.

On the far right (easy side) of the spectrum is the IPA (also known as the high-PA). Again, I am not totally trying to diss this. Their lifts have evolved from the conventional squat to more of a hip lift . As lifters are proving, quad strength is taking a back seat to ass and hamstring strength. I do not necessarily think this is bad. I would imagine with ultra wide stances, monolifts, and canvas suits, you are going to see much less career ending patella ruptures, injuries, etc. Also, we get to see more impressive numbers

So, all that shit being said, here is what I recommend (and am doing).

I have an APF meet coming up in 10 weeks. It is a state meet so judging will be a little looser. I am squatting almost as wide as my westside stance, but a little bit in (~2 inches). On my videos, I am breaking parallel.

I am seriously considering the IPA meet in November, and if i do this, I will add 1 - 2" of height to my speed day and squat as wide as possible. I know that a parallel squat will pass here so i will train for it.

Know where you are going to lift. Train accordingly.

By the way, there is one more aspect to getting a squat passed. It is the illusion of depth. If you are blessed with big legs and a semi truck for an ass, you will have a little tougher time getting a lift passed. Everyone argues about what part of the hip has to break parallel. BUT, the faster you come down, the less opportunity you give a judge to inspect his 'imaginary line'. If you can master the technique, squatting fast is better! I couldn't do this for a long time on the box because my ham strenght was not there, but I have gradually turned my squats faster and faster. Just make sure you have the technique down so you dont slam the box. Your spine will thank you.

train hard!
/irish

 

[brianmincher]

Thank you very much. I think that my hams and hips are probably not strong enough yet to get to convincing depth. I have noticed when squatting on a lower box (around 12 inches or so) that I flop the last couple inches onto the box. I cannot imagine it is a flexibility issue, as I am still able to do the splits, but it is probably more of a strength issue, as I am not strong enough to explode out of the bottom after attaining the rather extreme stretch necessary to get to the box.

It is obvious to me that I have traditionally not been using a low enough box for speed work, and have not, until last friday done a truly low box squat for max effort day at all. My hope has been to retain the working weights I was using at a higher box height while working my way down to a lower box. I may need to scrap that idea and just go to a low box and slowly work back up in weights.

I too have noticed that with my stance extremely wide, I cannot get very deep. But after watching myself on video, I was pretty pissed off, I am going to have to do some work to get my ass down, and I have to figure out some way of keeping a bit more upright with the bar. It looks like I am trying to good morning the damn weight right now.

thanks again,

B.

 

[Deciever]

i squat with my feet almost out to the edge of the power rack.. i can get down 2-3 inches below parallel, but no further.. im not very flexible either.. maybe its just the joys of being youthful?? Im going to be fooling w/ my stance today after good mornings to see what feels good.

Irish, nice post.

 

[I'D RATHER BE DEADLIFTING]

I have been doing my box squat with my feet to the edge of my power rack since I started. Do you think I should do them outside the rack, so I can get my feet wider? I have never had a problem with depth, but if this is going to strengthen my squatting muscles better, maybe I should switch.

 

[TheFng]

I'm 5' 9" and its 21.5" from the top of my knee to the floor when I'm sitting down and barefoot. I squat off an 11" box. I plan on lifting in a strict fed so I've been going good and low. I'm having trouble making any decent progress because of my hip inflexibility/strength. Hopefully my strategy will start paying off soon.

 

[IrishPower]

TheFng: IMO, if you lift in a strict federation, you are going to have trouble with the ultra-wide stance. i still think people should not squat so wide it is uncomfortable. If you are not making progress, something should change. The squat is one lift you should continue to make regular progress on without too much effort unless you are at the top of your game or are injured. Are you squatting with groove briefs? Doing so will help with the hips and getting explosive off the bottom of a wide squat. is your speed weight too heavy? if so, try backing off to less than 50% of 1RM (suited). You will develop more explosion and can save some energy for taking some heavies. Is your lower back giving out. Reverse hypers and abs are in order.

IRBD: depends on how wide your rack is. mine is wide enough that i cant imagine going any wider. its cool cause my feet can poke out the sides. the crossbars are raised high enough for feet to slip under easily.

Deciever: why would you want to go lower than 2-3" below parallel? if anything, i'd raise you box to you are just 1" below parallel on speed day otherwise you will teach yourself to go too deep at a meet.

if its for max effort day, just move your stance in and you will now be further below parallel with the same box. thanks for the comment on my post.

/irish

 

[TheFng]

I should probably clarify a couple of things. My stance is 24" wide. It is the exact same stance I would use playing shortstop in the ready position. The reason I haven't "gained" is that I started squatting off the 11" box (milk carton) whereas before I wasn't box squatting but just going to parallel. My box squat is now about what my higher normal squat was 4 months ago (low 300's).

I really do need to increase my speed so I will take your advice and drop the weight some more on DE day. As far as the briefs, no I don't. I lift in sweats only. I did just try a Champion suit and knee wraps and I failed to get 265 up. I had the worst workout of my life wearing that shit. I quit lifting and went out a few hours later in sweats and knocked out 4 sets of box squats with 275 for 5,5,4 and 2. I think that fucking suit is too small. I couldn't even get the straps up.

 

[Deciever]

irish: im lifting in the USAPL. and all i've heard is that they are strict as hell in judging squat depth... i dont want to bomb out of my first sanctioned meet... i wont go lower than 2-3" below parellel.

Usually for box squats i use a box that is 2-3" below parallel.. should i raise my box up for both speed days and ME days??

 

[IrishPower]

i dont know how the server lost my reply, but i will try again.

if you are lifting USAPL, they ARE strict as hell. i think they used to be USPF. you probably should keep your box low.

if you migrate over to a different org, you should put your box 1" below parallel on speed day. westside does different stuff on ME day. I just keep the same box height and use a close stance OR go off higher boxes with a wide stance. i dont ever go off a really low box.

/irish

 

[Deciever]

alright , thanks irish... im glad i can get low enough to get 2-3 inches below in my stance.

For now, my box is just a milkc rate w/ a small 1/4 inch think rubber mat on it.